> QUESTION?
>
> I understand TSMC produces the most chips in the world, and is located
> in Taiwan . Where did they get that technology and who paid for that
> technology?
Being old enough to be there and experience the start of mass-production of
copy/duplicate/counterfeit goods in the late 70's and 80's, I'd say it all
started with "Made in Taiwan" goods.
From my perspective from childhood on, it was in the form of knock-off
toys, brand name fashions, CD's, tools, you name it, it was everywhere new
and used, and it was all "Made in Taiwan". Not sure if it was them simply
getting the impetus to clone our stuff, or someone surreptitiously asking
them to do so to undercut established brands from here. Either way, it set
off the flood into our domestic markets for crapgadgets.
Taiwan goods were always just a bit crappier, sort of mislabled, would
always break early if not out of box, would never fit quite right, but hey
it was a fraction of the price! In my teens my focus was tools growing up
to be a mechanic, and buying second-hand goods would always see a direct
clone of a $100 "Snap-On" brand high-end wrench as a $5 "Stack-On" clone
from Taiwan. Harbor Freight made a name and business selling knock-off
American "Chicago Pneumatic" tools as "Central Pneumatic" (many others
too), all Made in Taiwan (now China), and still does.
In the 80's, US orgs began asking Taiwan to actually make these things for
us including eventually semiconductors for us, even giving them the plans,
when they already had the clone game down pimp tight. That's about the
time China took over and now frowns upon mentioning Taiwan as anything
other than China, thus generically everything is "Made in China" since then.
As we sent our engineering designs there to get bargains in production, and
taught them how to make our things including the machinery. Eventually
those copies as part of reverse engineering became prototypes, continued to
be made and improved on, if not in quality, in profit margins to make them
cheaper, even eventually adapting into new products. As it was always
explained to me, it starts with them making "one for me, then one for
themselves", and later "one for me, two for themselves", ad nauseam.
Next thing you know you have Coach purses rolling out of the same factory
as the Couch purses that look the same sold in swap meets and alleyways
around the world, barely indistinguishable except the receipt. Even worse
now, you get things like selling counterfeit Cisco switches to everything
from government to education
<
https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/ceo-guilty-of-selling-counterfeit-cisco-devices-to-military-govt-orgs/>
using modchips to bypass security on the clone
<
https://hackaday.com/2023/02/01/counterfeit-cisco-hardware-bypasses-security-checks-with-modchips/>,
or buying pretty much anything of Amazon is likely a counterfeit clone of a
clone of a clone.
Who's to blame indeed...
-mb
On Wed, Jun 7, 2023 at 3:29 PM Keith Smith via PLUG-discuss <
plug-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org> wrote:
> On 2023-06-07 13:59, James Mcphee via PLUG-discuss wrote:
> > Generally, if I hear it from cable news, there's a good chance it's
> > just someone drumming up support for something. In this case, we'll
> > probably hear about some kind of H1B system to make sure the new fabs
> > get all the people they need, etc. Same deal as when I was working at
> > a company that got bought by Dell, and they failed to retain most of
> > the new employees because they didn't have a structure that worked
> > with professionals. Suddenly you saw Michael Dell doing an interview
> > on CNBC about the need to extend H1B 'cause they aren't getting enough
> > workers. At the very least, there's plenty of incentive to drive down
> > labor costs. And with the halts for new housing going out, there is a
> > LOT of incentive to manipulate the market.
> >
> > Am I being paranoid? I probably need to touch more grass.
>
> Are you getting too paranoid? Maybe not. I quit following the news
> because I think most are fearmongering and not talking and working on
> the real problems.
>
> I personally do not like the H1B visas because I do not think they are
> necessary. If there is really a shortage of tech workers then why is
> there not a few major tech universities? Why does Gates exploit the H1B
> and not create a really great tech university? And why do the
> politicians allow all of this?
>
> We have all we need right here in our 50 states, so why do we not do
> things that benefit ourselves and possibly others?
>
> These people like Michael Dell, Bill Gates, etc have forgotten where
> they came from.
>
> QUESTION?
>
> I understand TSMC produces the most chips in the world, and is located
> in Taiwan . Where did they get that technology and who paid for that
> technology?
>
>
>
> >
> > On Wed, Jun 7, 2023 at 1:15 PM Jim via PLUG-discuss
> > <plug-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org> wrote:
> >
> >> Don't believe everything you read on the internet. I've read that
> >> Abraham Lincoln blames Donald Trump for giving the gun to John
> >> Wilkes Booth.
> >>
> >> On 6/6/23 17:45, Keith Smith via PLUG-discuss wrote:
> >>> Chip maker TSMC is moving to chandler and I have read they are a
> >>> sweatshop....
> >>>
> >>> ---------------------------------------------------
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> >>> https://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
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> >
> > --
> > James McPhee
> > jmcphe@gmail.com
> > ---------------------------------------------------
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> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > https://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
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