Re: NVMe: was Building a Linux Computer?

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Author: Stephen Partington
Date:  
To: Main PLUG discussion list
Subject: Re: NVMe: was Building a Linux Computer?
alternatively you could choose something like this.

https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-16GB-Solid-State-Drive/dp/B003YMJPE8

or
https://www.amazon.com/KingDian-Capacity-Promotion-Internal-Upgrade/dp/B015CIAZCW/

On Tue, May 29, 2018 at 8:57 AM, Carruth, Rusty <>
wrote:

> Well, but it wasn't (as far as I could tell) wearing out the media.
>
> But, since they're cheap, it might be interesting if someone tried that
> and let us know how it goes...
>
> (and I should mention we have the same problem with using them as FreeDOS
> boot (and thus C:). We write some data there, but nothing like using it
> for swap ;-)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: PLUG-discuss [mailto:plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org] On
> Behalf Of Brian Cluff
> Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2018 8:52 AM
> To:
> Subject: Re: NVMe: was Building a Linux Computer?
>
> For boot I would think they would work for darn near forever since they
> will be getting little in the way of writes. For / on the other hand,
> especially if you put some home and tmp directories on them, there are
> enough writes to kill them quickly.
>
> Brian Cluff
>
> On 05/29/2018 08:37 AM, Carruth, Rusty wrote:
> > BEWARE! Some vendors will not support using their USB sticks as boot
> drives!
> >
> >
> > For example, Kingston DataTraveller sticks are EXPLICITLY NOT SUPPORTED
> (that is to say, warranty is voided) if you use them as a boot drive!!!!!
> (I know because I asked them)
> >
> > I've got about 20 of the Kingston stick that ended up dying after being
> used as / - YMMV if you ONLY use it for /boot. Now, if you reformat them
> they will work for a while, then die again, at least when used this way.
> >
> > NOT recommended as / MIGHT work as /boot.
> >
> > I think I've got a few cruzers that failed also, but I'd have to look.
> >
> > Rusty
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: PLUG-discuss [mailto:plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org] On
> Behalf Of Brian Cluff
> > Sent: Monday, May 28, 2018 12:16 AM
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: NVMe: was Building a Linux Computer?
> >
> > I was thinking about one of those super low profile usb flash drives
> like:
> > https://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Cruzer-Low-Profile-
> Drive-SDCZ33-016G-B35/dp/B005FYNSZA
> > That is small enough that it won't get bumped and broken easily and you
> > would have to go out of your way to pull it out of the system since
> > there isn't much to grab hold of.
> >
> > As for speed, the amount of data that is coming off of the USB drive is
> > minimal, so even if it was a little slow it wouldn't really slow down
> > the boot process much.
> > Besides, who cares about the boot time. The real bonus will be programs
> > starting instantly once you are up and running on and NVMe.
> >
> > Brian Cluff
> >
> > On 05/25/2018 10:04 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
> >> Knowing my luck I'd lose that USB drive (I assume you mean a thumb
> >> drive, not a USB connected spinner). Am I correct that /boot on the
> >> thumb drive would slow the boot process, but everything after early
> >> boot would take place at NVMe speed? I'm not particularly choosy about
> >> boot speed. Go make a cup of tea.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >>
> >> SteveT
> >>
> >> On Fri, 25 May 2018 12:57:45 -0700
> >> Brian Cluff <> wrote:
> >>
> >>> You can always get a physically very small USB drive and put /boot
> >>> and the boot block on that. Then everything else can go on the NVMe.
> >>>
> >>> Brian Cluff
> >>>
> >>> On 05/25/2018 12:17 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
> >>>> Maybe you can get a rip-roaring machine, but how so if that post
> >>>> 2005 computer can't boot of NVMe? What do you do, take the UEFI
> >>>> info and the /boot off another drive, and use the NVMe for / ? Or
> >>>> do you boot off another drive, and then carve up the (assumedly
> >>>> small) NVMe into /usr, /lib, /run ? Life gets a lot more
> >>>> complicated if the machine can't boot the NVMe.
> >>>>
> >>>> SteveT
> >>>>
> >>>> On Wed, 23 May 2018 01:16:21 -0700
> >>>> Eric Oyen <> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> well, the beauty about the "add-in" cards is that you can use any
> >>>>> PCI-e slot on just about any desktop that is newer than vintage
> >>>>> 2005. YYou will end up with a rip-roaring fast machine. :)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -eric
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On May 22, 2018, at 2:43 PM, Carruth, Rusty wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Oohh! Oohh!! Something I can answer :-)
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> 1 - yes and no. Yes, you can replace, but no, you (almost
> >>>>>> certainly) need to get a PCIe card which converts PCIe on the
> >>>>>> motherboard to NVMe on the ssd. We have one of those at work, not
> >>>>>> too expensive as I recall.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> 2 - You should be able to. Don't know if that's implemented or
> >>>>>> not.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> 3 - /dev/nvme0n1 as an example. So, for SATA, its /dev/sd<x> for
> >>>>>> nvme, you get a /dev/nvme0 and then you get /dev/nvme0n1 for the
> >>>>>> actual drive, as I remember. I don't remember what the partitions
> >>>>>> turn up as, but I THINK they were /dev/nvme0n1p1 or something like
> >>>>>> that. A second NVMe drive would be /dev/nvme0n2 I think.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> 4 - it should. Now, you MIGHT need some updated stuff, for
> >>>>>> example smartctl may or may not work with NVMe on your distro.
> >>>>>> And you'll probably need to download the nvme tool that gives you
> >>>>>> control sort of like hdparm. Using an 'old' distribution might
> >>>>>> be a problem (for some value of 'old')
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>>>> From: PLUG-discuss
> >>>>>> [mailto:plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org] On Behalf Of
> >>>>>> Steve Litt Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2018 2:30 PM To:
> >>>>>> Subject: NVMe: was Building a
> >>>>>> Linux Computer?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Tue, 22 May 2018 13:57:29 -0700
> >>>>>> Brian Cluff <> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> For me, I would get a system that can use a NVMe. They are about
> >>>>>>> the same price as an SSD, but make and SSD look extremely slow.
> >>>>>> This is the first I've heard of NVMe. I just read
> >>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NVM_Express , and now have some
> >>>>>> questions:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> 1) Can I replace the spinning platter 2.5" hard disk in my 5 year
> >>>>>> old laptop with an NVMe device? My research tells me an NVMe must
> >>>>>> plug into a PCIe slot rather than a SATA slot.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> 2) Do you fstrim NVMe-hosted partitions the same way you do for
> >>>>>> SSD?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> 3) When you install an NVMe card in a PCIe slot, what device name
> >>>>>> shows up? Is it sd-whatever, or something else?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> 4) If my desktop has a free PCIe slot, does that mean I can plug
> >>>>>> in an NVIe drive and use it?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> SteveT
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Steve Litt
> >>>>>> June 2018 featured book: Twenty Eight Tales of Troubleshooting
> >>>>>> http://www.troubleshooters.com/28
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
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--
A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.

Stephen
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