Well, it might be protecting your computer but if it is too low it will
just be annoying.
You still need to run sensors and get those numbers if you haven't yet:
https://askubuntu.com/questions/15832/how-do-i-get-the-cpu-temperature
If your machine is legitimately overheating you need to address that with
fans and ventilation, etc.
On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:59 PM, Michael <
bmike1@gmail.com> wrote:
> if there is a shutoff point you did say disable it?
>
>
> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:56 PM, Brien Dieterle <briend@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Well, you're on the right track. Try to isolate whether glmark alone can
>> crash it, or if you need stress as well. Then try opening up your case
>> and point a fan in there.
>> Also don't forget to check the BIOS for thermal management events that
>> might be causing the shutdown/reboot.
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:52 PM, Michael <bmike1@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> never mind..... I ran glmark around 5 minutes and then stress. that
>>> crashed the machine! Not a nice reboot (like what it does with dt) but a
>>> power failure outage,
>>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:41 PM, Michael <bmike1@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> and if glmark2 doesn't crash it run stress the same amount of time?
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:37 PM, Michael <bmike1@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> how long do I let glmark2's pretty horse rotate?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:36 PM, Michael <bmike1@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> okay
>>>>>> `
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:10 PM, Brien Dieterle <briend@gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'd wait. If stress alone doesn't crash, run glmark2 by itself.
>>>>>>> If glmark2 doesn't crash, run them both at the same time.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:01 PM, Michael <bmike1@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> run this now or after stress completes?
>>>>>>>> ?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 5:59 PM, Brien Dieterle <briend@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Well, not yet ;-). If it doesn't crash, you might need to stress
>>>>>>>>> the graphics card as well with one of these tools:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://www.pcsuggest.com/gpu-benchmarking-and-stress-testin
>>>>>>>>> g-in-linux/
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So maybe kick off both stress and
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> glmark2 --run-forever
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 2:55 PM, Michael <bmike1@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> if it doesn't crash I'll start hounding the darktable forums.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 5:45 PM, Michael <bmike1@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Just started..... lets see what happens
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 5:36 PM, Brien Dieterle <
>>>>>>>>>>> briend@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Forget darktable for now. Did you run stress test for more
>>>>>>>>>>>> than 10 seconds?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> This will run a stress test for 30 minutes:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> stress --cpu 8 --io 4 --vm 2 --hdd 2 --timeout 1800s
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> If you can get it to crash with just this stress program, then
>>>>>>>>>>>> it has nothing to do with darktable
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 2:24 PM, Michael <bmike1@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have no sensors running and as for it panicing when warm
>>>>>>>>>>>>> sometimes it panics after I run dt 2 minutes after it had been shut down an
>>>>>>>>>>>>> hour and doesn't panic even though dt had run10 minutes.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 4:31 PM, Brien Dieterle <
>>>>>>>>>>>>> briend@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Check your bios settings for hardware monitoring and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> temperature limits. You may have it set with a maximum temperature so the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> machine panics when it's just warm.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Try raising this number or disabling the feature entirely
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But first check your sensors by installing a temperature
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> monitoring program
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Oct 30, 2017 1:04 PM, "Michael" <bmike1@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it is sooo ify! I just ran it for like 10 minutes with no
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> crashes whereas before I had just started the computer and ran dt for 2
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> minutes and it crashed. Then I restarted and I had a repeat performance of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the 2 minute thing.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:38 PM, Michael <bmike1@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> $ stress --cpu 8 --io 4 --vm 2 --vm-bytes 128M --timeout
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 10s
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stress: info: [7571] dispatching hogs: 8 cpu, 4 io, 2 vm, 0
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hdd
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stress: info: [7571] successful run completed in 10s
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't know what that was suppossed to tell me but there
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it is.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:36 PM, Michael <bmike1@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am experiencing no slowness. It is like the days where
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you had a power switch on the back of your computer... or it is like a hard
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reboot.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:33 PM, Stephen Partington <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cryptworks@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OpenCL in darktable mainly impacts rendering. it should
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have no effect on on system or ram consumption unless you are experiencing
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> slowness during render cycles.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 12:21 PM, Michael <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bmike1@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You know.... I'm having trouble running darktable. It
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> seems that after I start it it runs a few minutes and then reboots the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> computer. Probably because I do not have a GPU (I don't think). Then I saw
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this thread and thought that I'd give that a try. So it seems I can not run
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> chrome and darktable at the same time.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ___
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 'lspci' shows that my graphics card is :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Advanced Micro
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] RV770 [Radeon HD 4850]
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and 'lspci|grep gpu' returned an empty set
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (if I did that correctly)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> so I suppose the cheapest way to fix this is to get a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> gpu.... correct?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 12:09 PM, Carruth, Rusty <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Rusty.Carruth@smartm.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In my experience, it’s almost always Firefox taking all
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of memory. (Or Chrome, or whatever web browser you’re using).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I agree with Mr B, run top or htop and see what’s,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> well, on top ;-)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Rusty
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [image: SMART_HRS_RGB]
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Rusty Carruth | Customer Support | *rusty.carruth@smarth.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <rusty.carruth@smarth.com>* | http://www.smarth.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [image: linkedin]
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/12955027/> [image:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> twitter] <https://twitter.com/@MilSSD>See the new M4[image:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cid:image004.jpg@01D348E7.AF930710]
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.marketwired.com/press-release/smart-high-reliability-solutions-announces-availability-its-new-highly-ruggedized-highly-2235071.htm>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> See us on Storage Search
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.storagesearch.com/smart2.html
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 510-624-5391 <(510)%20624-5391> | Fax: 480-926-5579
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <(480)%20926-5579> | 1325 N. Fiesta Blvd. Suite 101
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gilbert, Az. 85233
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *From:* PLUG-discuss [mailto:plug-discuss-bounces@l
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ists.phxlinux.org] *On Behalf Of *Michael Butash
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Sent:* Sunday, October 29, 2017 10:05 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *To:* Main PLUG discussion list
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Subject:* Re: computer slow
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If I ever have that, it's usually because of something
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with a memory leak, or desktop graphic compositing is degrading over time.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Before you reboot, see if you can ssh into it from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> another computer and check htop (or just top all you have), see if
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> something is consuming all your memory or cpu.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Desktop compositors are all shite from what I can tell
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (including windoze), they're all just a varying degree of broken when you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> push them, or just have a slow (or buggy) video card. Depending on your
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> desktop environment of choice, try turning down graphics options, or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> disabling the compositor all together to see if it helps stability.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -mb
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 3:41 AM, Michael <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bmike1@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm almost certain that in my bag of tricks I had
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> instructions on 'resetting' my computer when it started acting weird but I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> can't find them. Riddle me this: I try to leave the computer on 24/7 (maybe
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I shouldn't do that) and twice so far I come up to it and it is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> non-responsive or really slow to respond. Anyone know how to fix this?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> settings:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> settings:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> settings:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> prevent you from rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> snooze button.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stephen
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> settings:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>
>>
>>
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>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
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>>
>
>
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
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> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
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