Is this a programming / sys admin phenomena or is it across the board
within all industries? I have always thought of technology in the terms
of sports. We all knew that guy or gal in high school that was a gifted
athlete, however they did not go beyond high school.
Out of all the gifted athlete in high school only a percentage go on to
college sports. Some will make it to the farm team. And only a handful
will make it to the pros. I think technology is much the same. To go
far in technology one needs to have that gift.
Over the years I have run into people who appear to be skilled
programmers or system admin that are not working in technology or are
underemployed.
Is it a problem with getting the first job? Once you have that first
job one can build from there?
I watched a guy start at inbound GoDaddy level 1 tech, moved to another
hosting company where he was a lead with sudo, to being a sys admin.
Maybe this is anecdotal. I don't necessarily think so.... This is how
I have seen people progress all my life. I'm open to hearing more.
One of the things I am not open to is gov interference or anything gov
funded.
Maybe the real problem is we do not have all the manufacturing jobs we
once had - those good paying manufacturing jobs.
On 2016-12-10 21:30, Stephen M wrote:
> Since I am a millennium I thought I should chip in at least once.
> Although this thread started has H1B which actually hurts both the
> foreign worker and the American work that's my stance there. The
> American worker is losing their job to someone that will take a lot
> less but do the same work. The foreign worker because they are being
> paid less and although there are places to live that are dirt cheap
> they are not always the best. The economy has suffered for years and
> there are too many contributing factors to name.
>
> Now the last couple of arguments are more hitting home. Yes I have a
> bachelors and a couple of certificates, working on more certificates,
> but still working help desk. Do I know more than that sure. Could I
> work in a different place that could accelerate my
> learning/understanding/knowledge whatever you want to call it yes.
> When my father was young he went to the military and went to school
> That was the first time he really touched a computer. So in those
> days yes it was almost handed to people to have jobs. Nowadays it's
> more of who you know rather than what you know. I can't tell you how
> many "network technicians" I've helped over the years to configure a
> router. I've worked to get where I am and struggling to move around.
> But it's not only my location but also my type of degree. CIS is not
> the most notable computer degree out there. But beyond that I have
> certificates, practice my *nix skills at home. But they don't mean
> anything to the work place. My other degree would be in business
> management so hopefully I'm not stepping on feet here.
>
> On the one hand you need to have the education and knowledge how to do
> what you work with. Getting a good paying job doesn't only help with
> that whether the company is paying for the training or not. But you
> also need to be physically strong and mentally healthy. So getting
> paid a living wage is necessary to have both of those. Sure you could
> be poor and be laid back and still get a decent job. But to uplift
> yourself does take a degree of basic needs. From economics when a
> people can satisfy their basic needs then they start to look at other
> needs. Now onto the reverse, like I said I've worked with enough
> technicians setup a router for nothing more than simple routing.
> These people properly knew someone and then they got hired and make
> decent money. So they could have high marks, certificates, and all
> other form of so called knowledge that means nothing. Yet they are
> still making big bucks.
>
> The take away here hopefully is one, foreign workers aren't getting
> screwed any less than American workers. You need to have your basic
> needs met first before you can worry about uplifting yourself. And
> last but not least not trying to sound like a recruiter but getting to
> know someone these days is a necessary. Just please don't call tech
> support asking how to put your router that has a static IP into bridge
> mode.
>
> On Sat, Dec 10, 2016 at 8:56 PM, Steve Litt
> <slitt@troubleshooters.com> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 10 Dec 2016 09:51:44 -0700
>> Keith Smith <techlists@phpcoderusa.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I had dinner with a couple guys from a programming agency last
>>> night. The senior owner is about 55 and the junior owner is about
>>> 35. I'm guessing they make exceptionally good money. What was
>> the
>>> mix that made them successful? Skills, personality, an hard work.
>>> They both attended college, developed some in demand skills, with
>> a
>>> little luck and hard work they are doing very well.
>>
>> These two guys are one anecdote.
>>
>> Your life story is another anecdote. A few anecdotes don't prove
>> anything. There are always people who can overcome obstacles. But
>> today's obstacles are much more difficult for the average person to
>> overcome.
>>
>> Except for the 82/83 recession, the 70's and 80's you remember as
>> difficult were paradise compared to the world faced by the last
>> decade
>> of high school grads.
>>
>> My assertions can be born out by statistics on cost of living,
>> unemployment, and real wages, broken out by age group. It's not hard
>> to
>> find.
>>
>> The shame is, a higher minimum wage and a few other minor tweaks
>> could
>> have fixed these problems enough to stay on a stable course.
>>
>> This is tired and offtopic. There's no convincing you that life
>> isn't
>> an endless meritocracy: I won't try further. Just don't come crying
>> to me if the nation you love and fought for disintegrates. It would
>> have been pretty easy to prevent with a stitch in time.
>>
>> SteveT
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>
> --
> Stephen Melheim
> 602-400-7707
> SMelheim85@gmail.com
>
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