I second Alan's motion. We are Linux users (or open source software users).
I try to get to every Linux activity I can.... Well I did when I was in
Phoenix. Now I'm in the middle of nowhere.
Can I volunteer to maintain the website (or at least the calendar)? I am
disabled and so have plenty of time on my hands to do that.
:-)~MIKE~(-:
On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 1:16 PM, Alan Dayley <
adayley@gmail.com> wrote:
> "and recent request from Alan Dayley not to discuss MPGLUG and DeVry
> Hackfesting on the Discussion and Security lists)."
>
> My request was unclear. I am sorry for that. Let me clarify.
>
> I do NOT want event announcements from other groups to stop. Please
> announce events in the PLUG lists.
>
> I DO want veiled arguments and attacks in such announcements to stop.
> There are so many Linux users and professionals in Phoenix that there is no
> need to disrespect any other group in order to build your own.
>
> Lastly, I have no power of policy making in PLUG at all. My request is
> from me, as a person who dislikes unproductive conflict.
>
> Alan
>
> On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 12:47 PM Lisa Desperation <desperategirl@gmx.com>
> wrote:
>
>> A good study of history, resource allocation and competition provides
>> clarity to set policy and provide fair open source choices.
>>
>> Please see the following message from Lisa Kachold (who started the
>> Hackfests with PLUG in 2008 [now associated with MPGLUG and in good
>> standing at DeVry University] which was censored from the PLUG MAILMAN
>> Discussion Lists related to removal of the Hackfests from the PLUG Calendar
>> (and recent request from Alan Dayley not to discuss MPGLUG and DeVry
>> Hackfesting on the Discussion and Security lists).
>>
>> There is a great deal of "gossip" strangely in this Linux community, with
>> outrageous claims that the "hackfests were thrown out of Ganglank for
>> hacking" (patently untrue [we are West Phoenix residents unhappy with
>> commuting to Chandler]), so it's incredibly important to evaluate the
>> "actual words" of individuals.
>>
>> For instance, we compare Todd Cole's admission of removing the Hackfests
>> from the schedule against resource use events in context. DeVry
>> University's donated OneNeck rack use by AZLOCO was pulled because of lack
>> of student involvement or direct campus meetings (after the DeVry DLUG
>> student David Huerta graduated and the DLUG disbanded) whereupon Hackfests
>> were given exclusive control over the rack and public IPs (where the AZLOCO
>> Big Blue Button server had been located).
>>
>> All linux user groups are healthy because of the historic willingness of
>> all members to GROW and INCLUDE discussion and sister community venues, not
>> censor or remove discussion and facts:
>>
>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>> From: Lisa Kachold
>> Date: Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 9:47 PM
>> Subject: Fwd: plug calendar
>>
>> Thanks Todd for your mail describing your direct role in the decision to
>> drop the 8 year old Hackfests from the PLUG calendar (excerpted below). I
>> really wish you or Hans or another PLUG member would have contacted me
>> either to state this decision or brainstorm a solution.
>> I understand that you have fostered bad feelings after DeVry University's
>> management requested that David Demland (and I) verify the student use of
>> the donated rack at OneNeck, which actually was not used at all for
>> anything but the AZLoco Big Blue Button server that you inherited after
>> their (student managed) DLUG was left without leadership (due to
>> graduation) and disbanded. Since AZLoco had no school relationship or
>> student interaction, it was suggested that we give you a chance to either
>> relocate your servers or begin working closely with the Hackfests or
>> another student or University involved open source event, as their rules
>> require. You chose instead, to quickly remove your servers and limit all
>> communication with me, which previously was regular, cooperative and
>> productive.
>> Unfortunately the PLUG Discuss List has failed to recognize the great
>> contribution the Hackfest provides to the community, to our interns and
>> DeVry/ITT students, and the value the open source security contributors and
>> professional linux community members have added through the last 8 years
>> interacting and supporting the Hackfest.
>> People attempting to attend the Hackfests complained because they
>> couldn't get into the DeVry University campus without instructions which we
>> were repeatedly unsuccessful getting posted on the PLUG Schedule. DeVry is
>> a closed secure campus, and the office volunteers often don't know what
>> event is happening when. Posting signs is also limited by school facility
>> security rules, and without detailed instructions on the PLUG schedule our
>> attendance suffered. We have NEVER missed a venue or a scheduled event
>> (especially not in the last 5 years [since you became active in the Plug
>> Schedule after you were asked to relinquish sole use of the OneNeck rack
>> (or become involved directly with DeVry students). Again we have failed
>> repeatedly over the years with our requests to get the Hackfest listing
>> specifics on the PLUG schedule. Our posts to the PLUG announce mailing
>> lists, and security have always gone out (or been sent) days before the
>> event and included instructions to either call 2 phone numbers for (David
>> Demland and/or I) or trade an ID at the office for an access badge to come
>> to room #231. I was alerted that no announcements were being sent, but
>> assumed that the PLUG was operated in a professional way, and if there was
>> an issue, I would be contacted. No announcements came to a second address
>> I use for test email which is also subscribed to all the email lists, so
>> when I finally found time between professional endeavors (IBM/Dell/local
>> current International security firm Sr. Systems Administration role) I
>> began to investigate.
>> We always have at least 10 community people (in addition to students) but
>> usually total attendance tops around 25 filling the lab where we use DeVry
>> desktop stations to demonstrate Kali Linux. This is a healthy venue that
>> will be continuing with one of the other local Users Groups and David
>> Demland, Tim Garcia (ITT), and the many other professionals contributing
>> presentations and suggestions.
>> I believe you are misreading the user complaints about the Hackfest which
>> were actually a complaint of the lack of instructions posted on the
>> schedule, for which you had the ability to effect. This is a terrible
>> failure of a LUG process when actually all that would have been required to
>> make it more successful would have been the addition of a good description
>> of access procedures to DeVry University including my very public phone
>> number on the PLUG schedule.
>> I have directed all of our attendees not to target either AZLoco or the
>> PhxLinux.org sites because of this controversy and long running conflict,
>> despite the fact that most CMS are trivially exploitable with the practical
>> tools and procedures we demonstrate at Hackfests in lab environments.
>> --Best
>> Original Email:
>> from: Todd Cole <Todd>
>> to: Lisa Kachold <someone>
>> date: Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 6:47 PM
>> subject: plug calendar
>>
>> Lisa
>> I no longer mail to plug list so I apologize on the delay and private
>> email.
>> Some of the things you have posted are in fact due to me. Several years
>> ago there were many errors in the plug calendar and the loco was a bit more
>> accurate. Hans now has kids and a family and Brian has a kid and full time
>> job and the calendar was sadly not kept up. I offered loco dates by feed at
>> first and then last year we went to a full feed from loco calendar. This
>> has been difficult to word events and top billing and whose name should be
>> first. There have been several volunteers that have started to maintain the
>> plug calendar but both have dropped it after minutes of updating events. As
>> of right now no one is maintaining the plug calendar and several broken
>> feeds and events some new, some wrong.
>> I have dropped the Hackfest from azloco calendar due to many complaints
>> several years ago of people showing up at events and finding no one there
>> and no note or notice of a cancelled event. Since you have moved to Devry I
>> was still getting a few calls that they could not locate or contact you at
>> an event and or people were at a event felt totally lost. I can understand
>> that your projects are not for a total noob or a basic user so after
>> discussions with plug and the loco it was decided not to promote Hackfest
>> at this time. If and when I get positive comments I will be happy to
>> reconsider for the loco end and I cannot speak for the plug side
>>
>> <end excerpt>
>>
>>
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