I wanted to send this to the list, because I think you make some excellent
points here. Also just for the record, I'm not necessarily saying I think
do web apps for smart phones is better. I'm merely providing POV from
someone working in the tech start-up space that that's what the industry is
currently leaning towards. I actually prefer native apps myself.
On Mon, Aug 4, 2014 at 7:51 AM, <
techlists@phpcoderusa.com> wrote:
> On 2014-08-03 19:14, Paul Mooring wrote:
>
>> This is a probably a longer and more involved conversation than you
>> think. There's a few primary factors in supply and demand for app
>> developers:
>>
>> 1. Native vs HTML
>>
>> There's a huge difference in the available supply of developers and
>> companies currently equipped to make an html5 site that plays nice
>> with both ios and android. I think we're likely to see a
>> proliferation of tools like phonegap (http://phonegap.com/ [6]) and a
>>
>> slow down of native apps as html apps eat that market share. When
>> you consider currently ios requires objective-C and android Java, you
>> have 2 languages with different tool chains and a more involved
>> development and release process competing against a very well
>> understood and super fast html/javascript ecosystem. In my opinion
>> html/js will eat the mobile dev community as quickly and dominantly as
>> it did for native Windows/OSX applications.
>>
>>
> This is akin to the argument for browser based applications 10 - 15 years
> ago. You build an app that runs in a browser and there is no deployment -
> just point your browser to the website.
>
> Building browser based apps that rival desktop apps is not easy. It is
> easier now that we have jQuery et al, however still not as easy as building
> desktop apps with Visual Basic (VB). It could take 10 - 20 times longer to
> build a really trick jQuery web app that rivals a VB app. Unless of course
> you build widgets that can be reused, then you spend a bunch of time the
> first go around and reuse those widgets. Still a lot of time building
> those widgets.
>
> I have not built any Android apps, however I suspect it might be faster to
> build them than HTML/(MySql/MariaDB)/CSS/JavaScript (jQuery). The down
> side is the different platforms. Which one do you go with and what is the
> market implications of doing so.
>
> Of course web apps require a server or at lease some cheap virtual hosting
> depending on the needs of the app.
>
>
> 2. Expanding platforms
>>
>> Currently ios and android own the market, but with microsoft,
>> mozilla, ubuntu, etc. all getting into the mobile os game it's
>> conceivable that the overall market could keep growing without making
>> android/java skills a "must have".
>>
>>
> This is down right ugly.
>
>
> 3. Better native app tooling
>>
>> Writing full featured web applications 10 years ago was really
>> hard. Rails, Django, Laravel, etc. along with REST APIs and json
>> revolutionized how we build web services making it a whole lot
>> easier. Then much more recently jquery followed by a million
>> javascript frameworks did the same for front ends. If native android
>> development keeps growing similar tooling is sure to be built to
>> drastically reduce the entrance barrier.
>>
>
> It's still very time consuming and requires skills that come with a
> learning curve.
>
> We are still stuck in the 80's with C versus the 90's with Visual Basic.
> You build your own widgets and development time is through the roof.
>
> Building mobile web apps takes a considerable amount of skill and arguably
> two distinct or possibly three distinct skill sets - 1) Programmers, 2)
> Designers, and 3) JavaScript / jQuery developers. I assume building an
> Android app requires one skill set - Android programming skills - a much
> smaller set of skills.
>
>
>
>> Overall I think it will become easier/cheaper/faster to build mobile
>> apps, but I sort of doubt that will manifest itself in the form of
>> most developers learning and rallying around Java and the Android API.
>>
>
> Thank you for your thoughts. In a nutshell I think what you are saying is
> there is high demand presently, the market will fragment, the demand will
> level out, and we should consider web apps first.
>
> The thing we have not talk about is marketing. I think this is what is
> motivating Joe. If one builds browser base application and you want to
> market it how do you do so? SEO is the main way. As Google continues to
> refine their algorithm trying to get a website to rank is getting more
> difficult. The alternative is to spend lots of money on advertising. Both
> approaches require deep pockets.
>
> If Joe releases his Android app it might get some traction. And it might
> be easier to market in the traditional way. The down side is only part of
> the market can run the app.
>
> My motivation for asking the question was purely wanting to know if the
> high demand for Android developers will last. No one can know for sure.
> While you say the market will splinter, I think Android will be a strong
> contender. I do not see M$ as a real market player. They have a lot of
> money and can put a dent in the market, however they seem to miss the boat
> in so many ways. Linux is such a better operating system and demands so
> much less resources to run efficiently. Now Apple is a big dog!! And they
> seem to do a lot of things right. Isn't OSX based on FreeBSD? Doesn't that
> make them cousins with Linux/Android? Could we see the merging of tools in
> this area?
>
> Thank you for your thoughts!!
>
>
>
>> On Sun, Aug 3, 2014 at 4:35 PM, <techlists@phpcoderusa.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Paul,
>>>
>>> One would think that Andriod programming is going to be with us for
>>> year... decade at least. However that begs the question, what do
>>> you (or anyone else) think the long term demand will be?
>>> Increasing or decreasing?
>>>
>>> Is there any barriers to entry like a nasty learning curve?
>>> Specialized hardware? ETC...
>>>
>>> I think I looked at the SDK about a year ago and as I recall it
>>> looked to be Java based and then I think I was told of a C++ SDK.
>>> IIRC - I think it was something that looked to take a little
>>> effort to learn but not too bad.
>>>
>>> I think i recall something about using JavaScript.....?
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>> Keith
>>>
>>> On 2014-08-03 16:09, Paul Mooring wrote:
>>>
>>> Not to discourage you from trying to make this happen, but a bit of
>>> perspective might help. Currently android/java developers are in
>>> great demand, where I live the average salary is around $110,000/yr
>>> or
>>> roughly $2100/week. Having done a bit of contract/outsourcing
>>> work
>>> myself, I can tell you the experienced contractors/developers
>>> intended
>>> to lose as much as a weeks time on any project just trying to
>>> understand what needs to happen and working with the stake holders
>>> to
>>> make changes along the lines of "one more simple thing". The take
>>> away is there's going to be a minimum price/complexity to justify
>>> taking on a project for a skilled/competent developer and if your
>>> app
>>> doesn't meet that benchmark you're going to have hard time
>>> finding a
>>> U.S. based competent developer interested in it.
>>>
>>> This doesn't mean it's a bad idea or you shouldn't do it, just keep
>>> in
>>> mind that while you may be really passionate about your idea to
>>> developers it's one of many offers to work on a contract for an
>>> individual offering below market rates. That's a great fit
>>> for
>>> contractors in India, students or a dev trying to expand her skill
>>> set
>>> (web dev still learning mobile apps, etc.) but not so appealing to
>>> established professionals.
>>>
>>> On Sun, Aug 3, 2014 at 10:04 AM, <joe@actionline.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Wanted: Android App Developer $??? Reward ...
>>>
>>> How can I find a skilled/competent/reasonably priced Android App
>>> Developer ... preferrably Arizona local or at least in the U.S.?
>>>
>>> I've tried elance.com [1] [1] and odesk.com [2] [2] and several
>>>
>>> similar
>>>
>>> sites, without
>>> success. Mostly get proposals from India and Pakistan, etc.
>>>
>>> I'm willing to pay up to $1,000 (perhaps more) to get the results
>>> we need
>>> for an app to read, scroll, flip pages, and search within a book.
>>> Should
>>> be relatively simple and straight-forward. Need to be able to add
>>> to the
>>> content and submit updates to the Google playstore myself.
>>>
>>> See my first-attempt (which does not yet work as well as we need it
>>> to)
>>> here:
>>>
>>>
>>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.
>> CompareBibleVersionsPackage
>>
>>> [3]
>>> [3]
>>>
>>> Please respond either here or off-line to joe(at)actionline.com [4]
>>> [4]
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss [5] [5]
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Paul Mooring
>>> Operations Engineer
>>> Chef
>>>
>>> Links:
>>> ------
>>> [1] http://elance.com [1]
>>> [2] http://odesk.com [2]
>>> [3]
>>>
>>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.
>> CompareBibleVersionsPackage
>>
>>> [3]
>>> [4] http://actionline.com [4]
>>> [5] http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss [5]
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss [5]
>>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Paul Mooring
>> Operations Engineer
>> Chef
>>
>> Links:
>> ------
>> [1] http://elance.com
>> [2] http://odesk.com
>> [3]
>> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.
>> CompareBibleVersionsPackage
>> [4] http://actionline.com
>> [5] http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>> [6] http://phonegap.com/
>>
>
--
Paul Mooring
Operations Engineer
Chef
---------------------------------------------------
PLUG-discuss mailing list -
PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org
To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
(text/plain)