Re: Summer Linux Classes at Mesa Community College

On Mon, May 23, 2011 at 7:56 PM, Phillip Waclawski <waclawski@mesacc.edu>wrote:

> The full, official title of the class is "Linux Operating System"
> http://www.maricopa.edu/curriculum/A-C/042cis126dl.html
> I agree that we do indeed need to write a class for an "Intro to the Linux
> Desktop".
> I disagree that we should throw out the command line. While it is not
> necessary for the average user to know all the power of the command line, it
> is a disservice to our students to pretend it doesn't exist. I have amazed
> some windows users with what you can do at the command line in windows, and
> of course there is now "powershell" and other tools for windows command
> line. A desktop class should only have a very brief/quick intro to the
> command line, but I would be opposed to a class that doesn't even mention
> it.
>
> Phil Waclawski
> CIS Faculty Mesa Community College
> (Technically Dennis and Der Hans' Evening Supervisor ;)
>

Phil,

If you have the evening shift, who watches Dennis and der Hans during the
day???? ;-)

Mark

>
> ------------------------------
> *From: *"Ted Gould" <ted@gould.cx>
> *To: *plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> *Sent: *Monday, May 23, 2011 7:43:21 PM
>
> *Subject: *Re: Summer Linux Classes at Mesa Community College
>
> On Sun, 2011-05-22 at 22:25 -0700, Dennis Kibbe wrote:
> > >It seems to me that "Introduction to Linux" is probably a bad title
> > for
> > >the class. It seems from the description it's closer to "Basic
> > System
> > >Administration of Linux." I, for one, would hope that we're at the
> > >point where the introduction to Linux in general doesn't include a
> > >command line.
> >
> > I start out with Ubuntu since it's easy to install anywhere and has
> > good support for VirtualBox. I want students to get excited about
> > Linux if they have never seen it before. After a couple of weeks with
> > Ubuntu we install CentOS either on the system or as a VM. This gives
> > them a taste of the Red Hat way of doing things and lets us explore
> > some things (runlevels, GRUB) that Ubuntu makes, well, just too
> > easy. :-)
> >
> > From the beginning I show them how the command line can automate a
> > simple task that if done in the GUI would take much longer. We do
> > spend quite a bit of time working in the CLI. Some students have come
> > back and told me that was the part they liked best about the class.
> > Others, well, just don't like to type. (This from the generation that
> > can type 30 wpm with their thumbs while navigating an LA freeway.)
>
> That makes sense, to be clear I'm not saying such a class shouldn't
> exist, just to the name. It seems that if I had a company that I was
> switching all my secretaries from Windows to Linux I might suggest they
> take an "Introduction to Linux" to be prepared for the shift. Clearly
> this isn't a course for them :-)
>
> I think that this is a problem that the "Linux Desktop" has in general.
> Too many people associate the term "Linux" with servers and think that
> it can only exist there. That means we'll never win in the consumer
> space. Perhaps that's why it's not "Android Linux" :-)
>
> > I wonder what things will be like in 3~5 years when keyboards are
> > obsolete and everything has a touchscreen?
>
> On screen keyboards? ;-)
>
> On Sun, 2011-05-22 at 21:43 -0700, der.hans wrote:
> > While I understand what you're saying, I disagree. Yes, basic GNU/Linux
> > desktop usage should not require use of the command line. Classes,
> > however, should at least give a basic introduction, especially in regards
> > to taking advice from the Internet that involves sudo, su or root :). A
> > class is a great place to demystify the command line for those unfamiliar
> > with it.
>
> While I'll accept other reasons, this one I won't -- lazy tutorial
> writers and blog authors shouldn't be a reason to teach people overly
> complex techniques. And, effectively, continue a mythology that you can
> only use Linux if you're a techie or able to use the command line well.
> As Linux enthusiasts we need to all work to rid the Internet of these
> instructions. I tried to convince a couple of folks at Google that they
> shouldn't index anything with the string "sudo" in it; I haven't been
> successful... yet...
>
> > Happily for you they specifically require GNOME knowledge :).
>
> They'll need to upgrade that to Unity knowledge ;-)
>

>                 --Ted

>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>
---------------------------------------------------
PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss