Patrick C:
I hope you won't be insulted by this remark which
is intended as a compliment: pretty good insights,
for someone of any age.
(I was almost going to end it with
"for someone who is your age",
but then I thought it might seem like
a bit of a "backhanded" compliment;
in any event, it is intended as a positive remark).
--
Mike Schwartz
Glendale AZ
schwartz@acm.org
Mike.L.Schwartz@gmail.com
On 3/28/07, Patrick C <
patrick.pxc.c@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> As someone who joined this list at 15 (I won't be 16 until July), I think
> it's appropriate here for me to add my "two cents."
>
> I've seen a few "flames" and a few clashes of opinion on this mailing list
> since joining, but for the most part, that's been unintimidating. A mailing
> list is an easy forum to walk away from. Flames typically aren't directed at
> me, and so as someone watching from the sides, I don't observe anything
> other than just people. People don't get along sometimes. That's just the
> way it works.
>
> Another aspect of this list, in my opinion, that diminishes the potential
> abrasiveness of so-called flames is that this list is so informally
> structured. Because it is, there really are no "higher ups." This list
> basically consists of either newbies or old-timers, but as far as I can
> tell, it doesn't say which is better than other. Respect is earned not
> simply through technical knowledge, but through helpfulness and personal
> presentation. Because of this, if I'm faced with a personal insult, I can
> handle it because it's just some guy; he doesn't mean anything, he doesn't
> lead the group, he may not even provide direction for the group. In a
> community where there are no formal leaders, there can also be no individual
> who is completely reflective of the community.
>
> The other thing, maybe for me, is that before I really started
> participating in this list, I attended a meeting and an installfest or two.
> Attending those allowed me to meet many individuals who belong to this list,
> and seeing them in an environment based around simple helpfulness at
> installfests or sharing of knowledge at a meeting reminds you that the
> ultimate goals of the members of this list are essentially the same: simple
> participation, simple community, and that despite whatever views clash and
> however brusque any particular member is, this list consists of peoplethat have feelings, moral judgements, and a general good will towards each
> other.
>
> I specifically remember the first meeting I attended, there was supposed
> to be a brief presentation on desktop acceleration. I had no history with
> this group, I wasn't active on the mailing list. I said I had done a little
> playing around with XGL and AIGLX, and thought I might be able to add
> something to the presentation, or show a few tricks. The so-called "leaders"
> of PLUG just let me (at least try to) do my thing without considering my age
> or my lack of history with the group. This group is full of knowledgeable,
> helpful, and ultimately (and most importantly) genuinely good people. If you
> haven't seen this or noticed this, I encourage you to attend a meeting or an
> installfest, and see for yourself.
>
> You may find friendly faces more inviting than dark words on a bright
> screen, even if you've already found the list itself to be inviting.
>
> --Patrick C.
>
> On 3/28/07, Nathan Aubrey <nathan@paysonlinux.org> wrote:
> >
> >
> > I don't know how old Michael is, but I just have the assumption he's a
> > young
> > guy, (sorry if you're older!). If I had been 14 or 15 when I joined this
> > list
> > I would have quickly lost my interest in Linux because of the negative
> > attitudes of many people I've encountered here over the years. I have
> > been on
> > this list for several years, and I've been using Linux since slackware
> > first
> > came out. I don't feel the need to impress anyone, or push my seniority
> > because I've used Linux longer than most people on this list. Nor do I
> > feel
> > stupid when I ask an extemely simple questiuon that I should have known
> > better. I take part in this list because there is a great wealth of
> > knowledge
> > amongst the pluggers, and I enjoy learning things that others do.
> > I felt bad that someone would jump on Michael for something so innocent,
> > and I
> > don't mean to get political, but frankly it pisses me off that someone
> > would
> > do that to someone who is trying to learn and just a little excited.
> > How many times have you been there before? I've been there many times.
> > Unfortunaley I've stumbled on cool things many times in the past, but
> > avoided
> > posting them to this list for this exact reason, I knew I would be
> > ignored or
> > blasted for wasting a few neurons.
> >
> > Please excuse the rant, but you asked for opinions!
> >
> > Nathan
> >
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