DefCon for kids

Tue Jun 28 20:59:49 MST 2011

I think your understanding was of aufthority, not clear and simple
consequences?  Of course a few might argue joining the military as opposed
to some of the other opportunities available might be a perfect example.

But of course this is a subject mired in subjective experience, values
systems and symantics, possibly therefore "junk science".

I would like to see how many kids end up at DecConforkids?

On Tue, Jun 28, 2011 at 8:54 PM, keith smith <klsmith2020 at yahoo.com> wrote:

>
> I have not been following this thread until now.  I found the statement
> "The human brain doesn't recognize consequences until age 25?" to be very
> interesting.
>
> I'm a little older. I joined the Marine Corps at 18.  My peers and I
> understood consequences almost from the first moment of entering boot camp.
>
> By 25 most enlisted marines, if they stayed in, would have 7 years in and
> have made it to the rank of E-5 or E-6.  When I was in some made E-5 -
> Sergeant within the fist 4 years.  That put them in a position of authority
> and responsibility, and they were only 21, 22, or 23 years old when they
> took on that responsibility that required a thorough understanding of
> consequences.
>
>
>
> ------------------------
> Keith Smith
>
> --- On *Tue, 6/28/11, Nathan England <nathan at paysonlinux.org>* wrote:
>
>
> From: Nathan England <nathan at paysonlinux.org>
>
> Subject: Re: DefCon for kids
> To: "Main PLUG discussion list" <plug-discuss at lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
> Date: Tuesday, June 28, 2011, 8:43 PM
>
>
> I am of the opinion that science is not always correct, regardless of how
> much "study" has been done. Science telling me that the human brain is not
> capable of making a decision without considering the consequences of the
> decision, yet all our known life came from some primordial ooze, or all
> existing matter came about through a one in a billion random chance big
> bang, only proves to me that science is not always right. More like the
> science is created to cater to someone's agenda.
>
> I specifically remember as a young child considering the consequences of my
> actions. Of course, I was also "spanked" as a child! oh no! someone call Dr.
> Spock! I think in reality we are trying to make these punk adolescents feel
> better by telling them it is not their faults, in order for a baby boomer
> society to make up for a lack of discipline in their homes while raising
> their children.
>
> just my .02
>
> On Tue, Jun 28, 2011 at 8:13 PM, Eric Cope <eric.cope at gmail.com<http://mc/compose?to=eric.cope@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
>
> There was a book published with the last few years talking about adolescent
> decision making. Adolescents have different value systems making their
> decisions look poor from adults point of view, but actually quite rational.
> It's was titled "the case against adolescence".
>
> Eric
>
>
> On Jun 28, 2011, at 7:19 PM, Lisa Kachold <lisakachold at obnosis.com<http://mc/compose?to=lisakachold@obnosis.com>>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 28, 2011 at 6:11 PM, Lee Reynolds <<http://mc/compose?to=Lee.Reynolds@asu.edu>
> Lee.Reynolds at asu.edu <http://mc/compose?to=Lee.Reynolds@asu.edu>> wrote:
> > The human brain doesn't recognize consequences until age 25?
> >
> > That sounds like a bunch of nonsense to me, the kind of stuff that is
> used to make excuses for adults acting like overgrown adolescents.  Perhaps
> the issue is not a matter of neurological development, but a matter of
> parents allowing their grown children to persist in a child-like state until
> they are almost 30.  I'm only 38 myself, but I do remember the days when
> growing up meant you grew up.  Maybe you went off to college, maybe you
> joined the military, maybe you lived with your folks but paid serious rent
> while attending college close to home.  But whatever you did, you were
> expected to be an adult, not a child.  Today many people in their early 20's
> are still living with mom and dad as if high school never ended.  Allowing
> someone to persist in that kind of a cocoon is a great way to wind up with
> someone who at first glance does not appear to understand consequences, when
> in truth they've simply never had to function in life as a normal adult.
> >
> > </rant_mode=off>
>
>
> I am not sure if it would be called "junk" but it's neuroscience backed up
> by long behavioral studies and statistics, as well as imaging.
>
>
> <http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy&hl=en&source=hp&q=consequences+brain+age+25&aq=f&aqi=&aql=f&oq=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=1df85bb4ccbea692&biw=900&bih=330>
> http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy&hl=en&source=hp&q=consequences+brain+age+25&aq=f&aqi=&aql=f&oq=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=1df85bb4ccbea692&biw=900&bih=330
>
> > Lee Reynolds
> > Tech Support Analyst Sr
> > ASU Advanced Computing Center
> > GWC-178
> >
> > 480.965.9460 (Office)
> > 480.458.7434 (Mobile)
> >
> > Have an A2C2 related question or problem?
> >
> > Just send an email to the following address detailing
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> > <http://mc/compose?to=support@hpchelp.asu.edu>support at hpchelp.asu.edu<http://mc/compose?to=support@hpchelp.asu.edu>
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From:
> <http://mc/compose?to=plug-discuss-bounces@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
> plug-discuss-bounces at lists.plug.phoenix.az.us<http://mc/compose?to=plug-discuss-bounces@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>on behalf of Kevin Brown
> > Sent: Tue 6/28/2011 5:17 PM
> > To: Main PLUG discussion list
> > Subject: Re: DefCon for kids
> >
> >>> Sounds like Cathy's daughter is the perfect person for DefCon according
> to
> >>> Chris' "Why is DefCon like sudoku?" presentation earlier this month.
> >>>
> >>>
> <http://mychildssuitcase.blogspot.com/2011/06/channelling-energy-of-geeky-techy-kids.html>
> http://mychildssuitcase.blogspot.com/2011/06/channelling-energy-of-geeky-techy-kids.html
> >>
> >> There is a good deal of material presented at DefCon that gives
> >> credence and lip service to breaking laws without consequences.  Youth
> >> are already at a disadvantage since the human brain does not recognize
> >> consequences until around 25 years old, while being required to be
> >> accountable since the age of 18.
> >
> > This sounds like junk science. Kids as young as 2 and 3 lie to avoid
> > getting into trouble which suggests they understand consequences for
> > their actions.
> >
> >> I would carefully counsel your daughters and sons about some of what
> >> is presented, the current state of government surveillance in America,
> >> and exactly where and when they have encroached private property and
> >> consequences.   A good example is the back page of 2600 magazine where
> >> jail inmates are given free classified space to write desperately for
> >> penpals from jail for such crimes.
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> --
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Nathan England
> I believe in the Constitution and the 4th Amendment. I am innocent and have
> nothing to hide, but NO agent of the state crosses my threshhold without a
> valid warrant signed by a judge and properly submitted. If we fail to
> exercise our rights, we lose them.
>
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