DefCon for kids

Tue Jun 28 20:54:54 MST 2011

I have not been following this thread until now.  I found the statement "The human brain doesn't recognize consequences until age 25?" to be very interesting.

I'm a little older. I joined the Marine Corps at 18.  My peers and I understood consequences almost from the first moment of entering boot camp.

By 25 most enlisted marines, if they stayed in, would have 7 years in and have made it to the rank of E-5 or E-6.  When I was in some made E-5 - Sergeant within the fist 4 years.  That put them in a position of authority and responsibility, and they were only 21, 22, or 23 years old when they took on that responsibility that required a thorough understanding of consequences.

------------------------

Keith Smith

--- On Tue, 6/28/11, Nathan England <nathan at paysonlinux.org> wrote:

From: Nathan England <nathan at paysonlinux.org>
Subject: Re: DefCon for kids
To: "Main PLUG discussion list" <plug-discuss at lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
Date: Tuesday, June 28, 2011, 8:43 PM

I am of the opinion that science is not always correct, regardless of how much "study" has been done. Science telling me that the human brain is not capable of making a decision without considering the consequences of the decision, yet all our known life came from some primordial ooze, or all existing matter came about through a one in a billion random chance big bang, only proves to me that science is not always right. More like the science is created to cater to someone's agenda. 

I specifically remember as a young child considering the consequences of my actions. Of course, I was also "spanked" as a child! oh no! someone call Dr. Spock! I think in reality we are trying to make these punk adolescents feel better by telling them it is not their faults, in order for a baby boomer society to make up for a lack of discipline in their homes while raising their children. 

just my .02
On Tue, Jun 28, 2011 at 8:13 PM, Eric Cope <eric.cope at gmail.com> wrote:

There was a book published with the last few years talking about adolescent decision making. Adolescents have different value systems making their decisions look poor from adults point of view, but actually quite rational. It's was titled "the case against adolescence". 

Eric

On Jun 28, 2011, at 7:19 PM, Lisa Kachold <lisakachold at obnosis.com> wrote:

On Tue, Jun 28, 2011 at 6:11 PM, Lee Reynolds <Lee.Reynolds at asu.edu> wrote:

> The human brain doesn't recognize consequences until age 25?
>
> That sounds like a bunch of nonsense to me, the kind of stuff that is used to make excuses for adults acting like overgrown adolescents.  Perhaps the issue is not a matter of neurological development, but a matter of parents allowing their grown children to persist in a child-like state until they are almost 30.  I'm only 38 myself, but I do remember the days when growing up meant you grew up.  Maybe you went off to college, maybe you joined the military, maybe you lived with your folks but paid serious rent while attending college close to home.  But whatever you did, you were expected to be an adult, not a child.  Today many people in their early 20's are still living with mom and dad as if high school never ended.  Allowing someone to persist in that kind of a cocoon is a great way to wind up with someone who at first glance does not appear to understand consequences, when in truth they've simply never had to function in life as a normal
 adult.

>
> </rant_mode=off>

I am not sure if it would be called "junk" but it's neuroscience backed up by long behavioral studies and statistics, as well as imaging.

http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy&hl=en&source=hp&q=consequences+brain+age+25&aq=f&aqi=&aql=f&oq=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=1df85bb4ccbea692&biw=900&bih=330

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> -----Original Message-----
> From: plug-discuss-bounces at lists.plug.phoenix.az.us on behalf of Kevin Brown

> Sent: Tue 6/28/2011 5:17 PM

> To: Main PLUG discussion list
> Subject: Re: DefCon for kids
>
>>> Sounds like Cathy's daughter is the perfect person for DefCon according to
>>> Chris' "Why is DefCon like sudoku?" presentation earlier this month.

>>>
>>> http://mychildssuitcase.blogspot.com/2011/06/channelling-energy-of-geeky-techy-kids.html

>>
>> There is a good deal of material presented at DefCon that gives
>> credence and lip service to breaking laws without consequences.  Youth
>> are already at a disadvantage since the human brain does not recognize

>> consequences until around 25 years old, while being required to be
>> accountable since the age of 18.
>
> This sounds like junk science. Kids as young as 2 and 3 lie to avoid
> getting into trouble which suggests they understand consequences for

> their actions.
>
>> I would carefully counsel your daughters and sons about some of what
>> is presented, the current state of government surveillance in America,
>> and exactly where and when they have encroached private property and

>> consequences.   A good example is the back page of 2600 magazine where
>> jail inmates are given free classified space to write desperately for
>> penpals from jail for such crimes.
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I believe in the Constitution and the 4th Amendment. I am innocent and have nothing to hide, but NO agent of the state crosses my threshhold without a valid warrant signed by a judge and properly submitted. If we fail to exercise our rights, we lose them.

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