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Ashton-Tate who created dBase found in the mid 80's that their sales =
dropped when they started all that copy protect stuff that was popular =
at the time. It seems that pirating actually stimulates sales.
I think once the masses rise up against M$ and/or some mechanism that =
allows for an override, M$ will come to it's senses. Can you imagine =
Corporate America being brought to it's knees because they are on hold =
waiting for an authentication number to reinstall, while hundreds or =
thousands of workers stand idle?
I think M$ will be humbled by this.
Keith Smith
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Vaughn Treude=20
To:
plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us=20
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2001 11:31 AM
Subject: Re: NT5 dual boot
I definitely agree with Keith on this one. I've tried both, and I =
think that trying to put multiple OS's on any single drive just isn't =
worth the trouble (unless maybe you're tucking an old version of DOS in =
a corner somewhere.) Drives are pretty cheap anyway. I know it's a =
waste when you've got one of those huge 20+ gig drives. But there are =
still a lot of smaller ones available. (A good cheap source is old =
PC's, which people discard as Windows and games get more and more =
resource-hungry.)=20
The removable-drive option sounds good (haven't tried it) but I =
wouldn't do that unless I had an additional data drive on the system. =
I'd keep all my documents, multimedia files, etc., on the fixed one, so =
it could be accessed from any OS. Unfortunately it would have to be in =
a format that Windows can recognize.=20
Regarding the "why" of dual booting, I've got no problem with using =
Windows, as long as you can stomach the frequent crashes of 9* (and Me?) =
and/or the hardware limitations of NT. But I was hearing from a =
colleague last night about the licensing and distribution changes that =
MS is proposing for its next release, Windows XP. They range from =
annoying (being forced to register the program to keep it running) to =
arrogant (you'll be required to keep a licensing sticker on the machine, =
so if you move the drive to a new case you're supposed to buy a new =
license) to downright idiotic (end users won't be allowed to install the =
OS. You'll have to have a MS technician do that.) Some of these =
"anti-piracy" innovations probably depend on the nationwide passage of =
UCITA. Others will probably go the way of the "we're merging Windows =
9* into 2000" nonsense. But I'll certainly be less inclined to buy or =
use ANYTHING Microsoft, if these things all come to pass.=20
(Please excuse me if you guys already knew this stuff. Sometimes I'm =
not paying attention the first time it comes out...)=20
Vaughn Treude=20
CIE-Keith wrote:=20
I had nothing but trouble trying to maintain w95 and Linux on the same =
drive. Every time I reinstalled w95 it would overwrite the mbr? and =
I=20
would have to play with lilo or reinstall Linux. I spent a week=20
trying to get the two to play nice with each other. I think it is a =
windows dominance problem.=20
My solution was to use two hard drives. Things work better however =
I=20
think the real solution is two removable hard drives. I will be=20
installing w2k server (NT5?) soon and will be using a removable. I=20
want to use the same box as both a w2k server and a Linux server, on =
separate removable drives. Of course this all in the privacy of my=20
home.=20
Keith Smith=20
(not the football player)=20
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Lucas Vogel <lvogel@exponent.com>=20
To: <plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us>=20
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 10:15 PM=20
Subject: RE: NT5 dual boot=20
> I have a Sony Vaio laptop with Windows 2000 that I set up with an=20
extra=20
> partition to install TurboLinux, which we got when we bought a hub =
for one=20
> of our offices. I could not for the life of me get the LILO to =
play=20
well=20
> with NT5 - I'm still not entirely sure why. I never DID get it to=20
work, but=20
> I read up on the MS website on something about a NTDetect.dos file =
or=20
> something similarly titled that you can edit to boot into "other=20
operating=20
> systems", though I don't know if that's MS wording for other MS =
OS's=20
or=20
> not...=20
>=20
>=20
> -----Original Message-----=20
> From: Eden Li [mailto:eden.li@asu.edu]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 9:12 PM=20
> To: plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us=20
> Subject: Re: NT5 dual boot=20
>=20
>=20
> Nah, it's not stupid... You probably can.. see the previous =
posts..=20
> I prefer LILO over NT's boot loader though..=20
>=20
> Eden=20
>=20
> On Tue, Feb 13, 2001 at 07:11:07PM -0700, CIE-Keith wrote:=20
> > Can you use the NT boot loader also? Please forgive my =
ignorance=20
if=20
> > this is a stupid question.=20
>=20
> ________________________________________________=20
> See http://PLUG.phoenix.az.us/navigator-mail.shtml if your mail=20
doesn't post=20
> to the list quickly and you use Netscape to write mail.=20
>=20
> Plug-discuss mailing list - =
Plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us=20
> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss=20
>=20
> ________________________________________________=20
> See http://PLUG.phoenix.az.us/navigator-mail.shtml if your mail=20
doesn't post to the list quickly and you use Netscape to write mail. =
>=20
> Plug-discuss mailing list - =
Plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us=20
> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss=20
________________________________________________=20
See http://PLUG.phoenix.az.us/navigator-mail.shtml if your mail =
doesn't post to the list quickly and you use Netscape to write mail.=20
Plug-discuss mailing list - Plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us=20
http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
--=20
*****************
Nakota Software, Inc.
Custom Industrial Software Development
=20
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Ashton-Tate who created dBase found in =
the mid 80's=20
that their sales dropped when they started all that copy protect stuff =
that was=20
popular at the time. It seems that pirating actually stimulates=20
sales.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I think once the masses rise up against =
M$ and/or=20
some mechanism that allows for an override, M$ will come to it's =
senses. =20
Can you imagine Corporate America being brought to it's knees because =
they are=20
on hold waiting for an authentication number to reinstall, while =
hundreds or=20
thousands of workers stand idle?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I think M$ will be humbled by =
this.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Keith Smith</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A href=3D"
mailto:vaughn@nakota-software.com"=20
title=
3Dvaughn@nakota-software.com>Vaughn Treude</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
href=3D"
mailto:plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us"=20
=
title=
3Dplug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us>
plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.pho=
enix.az.us</A>=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, February 14, =
2001 11:31=20
AM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: NT5 dual =
boot</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>I definitely agree with Keith on this one. I've =
tried=20
both, and I think that trying to put multiple OS's on any single drive =
just=20
isn't worth the trouble (unless maybe you're tucking an old version of =
DOS in=20
a corner somewhere.) Drives are pretty cheap anyway. I =
know it's a=20
waste when you've got one of those huge 20+ gig drives. But =
there are=20
still a lot of smaller ones available. (A good cheap source is =
old PC's,=20
which people discard as Windows and games get more and more=20
resource-hungry.)=20
<P>The removable-drive option sounds good (haven't tried it) but I =
wouldn't do=20
that unless I had an additional data drive on the system. =
I'd keep=20
all my documents, multimedia files, etc., on the fixed one, so it =
could be=20
accessed from any OS. Unfortunately it would have to be in a =
format that=20
Windows can recognize.=20
<P>Regarding the "why" of dual booting, I've got no problem with using =
Windows, as long as you can stomach the frequent crashes of 9* (and =
Me?)=20
and/or the hardware limitations of NT. But I was hearing from a=20
colleague last night about the licensing and distribution changes that =
MS is=20
proposing for its next release, Windows XP. They range from =
annoying=20
(being forced to register the program to keep it running) to arrogant =
(you'll=20
be required to keep a licensing sticker on the machine, so if you move =
the=20
drive to a new case you're supposed to buy a new license) to downright =
idiotic=20
(end users won't be allowed to install the OS. You'll have to =
have a MS=20
technician do that.) Some of these "anti-piracy" innovations =
probably=20
depend on the nationwide passage of UCITA. Others will =
probably go=20
the way of the "we're merging Windows 9* into 2000" nonsense. =
But I'll=20
certainly be less inclined to buy or use ANYTHING Microsoft, if =
these=20
things all come to pass.=20
<P>(Please excuse me if you guys already knew this stuff. =
Sometimes I'm=20
not paying attention the first time it comes out...)=20
<P>Vaughn Treude=20
<P>CIE-Keith wrote: <BR>I had nothing but trouble trying to maintain =
w95 and=20
Linux on the same=20
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3D"CITE">drive. Every time I reinstalled w95 it =
would=20
overwrite the mbr? and I <BR>would have to play with lilo or =
reinstall=20
Linux. I spent a week <BR>trying to get the two to play nice =
with each=20
other. I think it is a <BR>windows dominance problem.=20
<P>My solution was to use two hard drives. Things work better =
however=20
I <BR>think the real solution is two removable hard drives. I =
will be=20
<BR>installing w2k server (NT5?) soon and will be using a =
removable. I=20
<BR>want to use the same box as both a w2k server and a Linux =
server, on=20
<BR>separate removable drives. Of course this all in the =
privacy of my=20
<BR>home.=20
<P>Keith Smith <BR>(not the football player)=20
<P>----- Original Message ----- <BR>From: Lucas Vogel=20
<lvogel@exponent.com> <BR>To:=20
<plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us> <BR>Sent: Tuesday, =
February=20
13, 2001 10:15 PM <BR>Subject: RE: NT5 dual boot=20
<P>> I have a Sony Vaio laptop with Windows 2000 that I set up =
with an=20
<BR>extra <BR>> partition to install TurboLinux, which we got =
when we=20
bought a hub <BR>for one <BR>> of our offices. I could not for =
the life=20
of me get the LILO to play <BR>well <BR>> with NT5 - I'm still =
not=20
entirely sure why. I never DID get it to <BR>work, but <BR>> I =
read up on=20
the MS website on something about a NTDetect.dos file <BR>or =
<BR>>=20
something similarly titled that you can edit to boot into "other=20
<BR>operating <BR>> systems", though I don't know if that's MS =
wording=20
for other MS OS's <BR>or <BR>> not... <BR>> <BR>> <BR>>=20
-----Original Message----- <BR>> From: Eden Li [<A=20
href=3D"mailto:eden.li@asu.edu">mailto:eden.li@asu.edu</A>] <BR>> =
Sent:=20
Tuesday, February 13, 2001 9:12 PM <BR>> To:=20
plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us <BR>> Subject: Re: NT5 dual =
boot=20
<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> Nah, it's not stupid... You probably =
can.. see=20
the previous posts.. <BR>> I prefer LILO over NT's boot loader =
though..=20
<BR>> <BR>> Eden <BR>> <BR>> On Tue, Feb 13, 2001 at =
07:11:07PM=20
-0700, CIE-Keith wrote: <BR>> > Can you use the NT boot loader =
also? Please forgive my ignorance <BR>if <BR>> > this is =
a=20
stupid question. <BR>> <BR>>=20
________________________________________________ <BR>> See <A=20
=
href=3D"http://PLUG.phoenix.az.us/navigator-mail.shtml">http://PLUG.phoen=
ix.az.us/navigator-mail.shtml</A>=20
if your mail <BR>doesn't post <BR>> to the list quickly and you =
use=20
Netscape to write mail. <BR>> <BR>> Plug-discuss mailing =
list =20
- Plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us <BR>> <A=20
=
href=3D"http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss">ht=
tp://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</A>=20
<BR>> <BR>> ________________________________________________ =
<BR>>=20
See <A=20
=
href=3D"http://PLUG.phoenix.az.us/navigator-mail.shtml">http://PLUG.phoen=
ix.az.us/navigator-mail.shtml</A>=20
if your mail <BR>doesn't post to the list quickly and you use =
Netscape to=20
write mail. <BR>> <BR>> Plug-discuss mailing list =
- =20
Plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us <BR>> <A=20
=
href=3D"http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss">ht=
tp://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</A>=20
<P>________________________________________________ <BR>See <A=20
=
href=3D"http://PLUG.phoenix.az.us/navigator-mail.shtml">http://PLUG.phoen=
ix.az.us/navigator-mail.shtml</A>=20
if your mail doesn't post to the list quickly and you use Netscape =
to write=20
mail.=20
<P>Plug-discuss mailing list - =20
Plug-discuss@lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us <BR><A=20
=
href=3D"http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss">ht=
tp://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</A></P></BLOC=
KQUOTE><PRE>--
*****************
Nakota Software, Inc.
Custom Industrial Software Development</PRE> =
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