Thanks Gilbert,
see my responses:
On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 2:00 PM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. <
mailing-lists@phoenixinternet.net> wrote:
> I will add my 2 cents ...
>
> I read all the posts. Experience on a specific system will allow a person
> to respond quickly but will not allow them to specifically solve a problem,
> especially if they are not as educated on a system as they think they are.
> If the Server is the documentation, you are riding by the seat of your
> pants and it will catch upto you. In addition, a business is more nimble
> and can accomplish more if there is redundancy in the understanding of
> systems in place. You must have a well documented system/process that a
> competent person can follow and update.
>
> I will now move my comments a little more off topic ...
>
> Now answering this as an employer hiring staff, experience counts for me;
> but I put more weight in an employee's education, ability to be agile,
> solve problems, communicate clearly, and work with others. I expect to
> train new staff from the bottom up on a system/process.
>
> Now we are off topic and maybe offending ...
>
> Some may disagree with me or feel I maybe belittling their career, but
> most jobs in IT, in my opinion, can be done by almost anyone if they are in
> the right mindset and given proper training. IT is not magic.
>
I agree; it is not magic. This can be taught as part of standard process
and "obnosis" or learning by observation, but only to those who have an
inherent ability.
Great programmers are BORN; not trained, but good systems administrators
and systems engineers are using a set techniques (and a lot of
typing/clicking) to do an excellent job. However, it is not easy and
cannot be trivialized.
>
>
> Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
> Phoenix Internet
>
>
>
> On 5/16/2013 9:03 PM, Lisa Kachold wrote:
>
> Across the board, the number 1 worst attribute that I see working with the
> PLUG, technology teams, and mentoring (at or around year 3 in academics,
> and year 3 - 10 in IT/linux professionalism) = arrogance.
>
> What exactly is arrogance anyway. Where is this found? Why?
>
> It's the place in the discussion where one person dominates assuming
> that their position or knowledge is greater (without investigation). This
> is also referred to as "OneUpManShip".
> It's the place in the presentation where students and PLUG peers write off
> the person who has taken on the role to "present on the subject" based on
> their ability to verbally spiel acronyms. This is referred to "Minimizing".
> It's the place in the team dissemination of project roles and tasks where
> a member's enthusiasm is downplayed based on experience. This is referred
> to "Dues Hierarchy".
> This is the place in the interview where the employer fails to realize all
> they need to do is very the work history, since everything for a Linux
> professional is motivated by and driven from an ethical systems
> administrator viewpoint (not any communications with or responsibilities
> disseminated from the employer); just as we are woken from sleep to work on
> or check systems; and jazzed beyond belief by a well engineered hardware
> server like IBM Blade (can you say Fiber channel switched backplane?)...
>
> There are a great many examples where an ego based emotional assumption
> of or judgement is placed on our peers, our work, and even ourselves at one
> point or another.
>
> The ability to understand linux systems requires a certain type of
> systemic theory; which can be daunting for some people; such systems
> integration can be hard to troubleshoot [and successfully negotiate within]
> without inherent abilities but can be done with a great deal of complex
> experience, however this is NOT ROCKET SCIENCE. So the people who do well
> at what we do, are usually those that find that they inherently find this
> easy.
>
> It is, however, far from easy, since most of us work long hours, without
> adequate physical exercise and balanced stress free environments. The sheer
> amount of responsibility and ultimate reliance in all shops on the unique
> abilities of the Unix/Linux systems administrator are daunting to most once
> they get a full view.
>
> However, we each learn standard process applied across the OSI stack
> and/or fed through the kernel/memory/processor for systems or DevOps
> applications performance and integration, security or troubleshooting.
>
> Standard process, which includes a few easy to learn rules, relies on
> logs and linux tools, completely supplants any experience, past systems
> history knowledge (available on/in the server), most visio documentation or
> RunBooks (which should not exist unless something cannot be known by server
> view alone).
>
> Ironically, to people who are not linux-ish, the statement that "The
> Server IS the documentation" seems incredibly arrogant, when in fact, it
> simplifies all the arrogant posturing and 7 deadly sin based profit from
> the misunderstanding of unix/linux administration and engineering.
>
> We all intimately understand the concept of "obnosis" or Knowledge by
> Observation - rather than what is imparted via formal rote learning and
> scholastic pursuit.
>
> What do you think? Is the adage "There is NO substitute for experience"
> correct or can anyone using standard process (as opposed to documented
> process) and NIX command line skills (yet bringing no experience) get to
> the finish line at the same time?
>
> http://wiki.obnosis.com <http://wiki.obnosis.com>
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