I think you missed my point. My Point : Just because there is as much crime last year as this year does not mean there isn't a problem.
So there might not be an increase in crime in LA. Does that mean that 1/2 the homicides in LA being from Illegals is not important.
The article you put a link to said there is no increase in crime. So if my neighbor was arrested last year for beating his wife and was arrested again this year for beating his wife there would be no change in the crime level. So do we solve the problem or say, hay crime has leveled off, lets go get a beer and let my neighbor's wife deal with it?
So Phoenix is number two and Mexico City is number one. I still want crime to be reduced.
Also if you are caught here illegally you must be remove back to your country. That is the law. No rewards. If we reward them then we must reward the guy that sole your car. Have you had a car stolen? Everyone I know has had a car stolen while living in Phoenix. I was here 90 days and they stole my truck. It was paid for and I had liability insurance. The next day I was $2500 poorer and had a $300/mo car payment. Not to mention my insurance went up because I now had full coverage on a new car. I'll almost bet you my truck was taken to Mexico by an illegal. Would take too much to explain why I believe that.
Just because crime stats are flat does not mean the crime being committed is not bad.
Bet you did not know that the labor and delivery department of the Bisbee hospital had to be closed. Why? Illegals crossing the boarder to have their babies. Now if you live in Bisbee and your wife goes into labor what do you do? Drive 30 miles to Sierra Vista. Tell me how that is a win-win situation.
What about Barnet? Was that fair? What about Rob Krenz who was killed outside of Douglas? The Cochise County Sheriff said crime has not risen in his county over the last 10 years. Tell that to Krenz's family.
Douglas has been to main point of entry for over 10 years. It is in Cochise County. Tell that to my father who had to leave Douglas because the town was over run with illegals.
Hey the crime level might have remained constant however there is a Border Patrol Agent on every corner. It has become a militarized zone. 650 Border Patrol Agents in a town that only has a population of 20,000 people.
Hey but crime has not risen!
------------------------
Keith Smith
--- On Tue, 5/18/10, Ariel Gold <
arielqgold@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Ariel Gold <
arielqgold@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: OT ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
To: "Main PLUG discussion list" <
plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
Date: Tuesday, May 18, 2010, 12:45 PM
I would be surprised if you DIDN'T see crime being in law enforcement, but your anecdotal evidence, while shocking at first, isn't very compelling. Just because people keep repeating talking points won't make me believe them.
For example, you said Phoenix is the kidnap capital of the world...from everything I can find I see it is number two in the world, after Mexico City. Sure, nothing to brag about,but just an example. Cites:
http://www.project.org/info.php?recordID=158 http://hotair.com/archives/2009/02/12/mexican-drug-cartels-make-phoenix-2-in-world-for-kidnappings/ http://www.drugaddictiontreatment.com/addiction-news/drug-crimes/phoenix-number-two-kidnapping-capital-as-drug-cartel-wars-intensify/ I also see pepole in forums making a reference that it is number one in the world, but I don't see what kind of weight hhat has...here someone uses the claim you made to try to sell karate classes:
http://phoenix.backpage.com/Classes/phoenix-is-the-kidnap-capital-of-the-world-see-you-at-arizona-traditional-karate/10020835
But honestly, not really afraid myself. I do feel sorry for you, and
other people if you are filled with fear. I don't think our policies
should be motivated by fear.
So you are seriously telling me the DOJ stats, cited by the conservative CATO institute, are misinformation?
In terms of the rest of your email. I don't deny that there is a drug war (a whole other can of worms) going on, but that doesn't mean that I want a father to be deported when he gets pulled over at a traffic stop, when his wife and kids have their papers, and he doesn't. Make him register. Make him pay a fine. Give him a path to citizenship. Imagine how afraid the wife and kids are,right now, wondering if the next time they get in the car their father is going to be put hauled away.
I just am sick of what I see as people saying things aren't going well for me (economically, career-wise, my love life, etc), so I may as well blame a Mexican!
Immigrants Add Nearly $1 Billion Annually to Arizona's Economy
http://uanews.org/node/13529
Also, if the economy is bad, many undocumented workers will leave anyways! It's simple supply and demand. this all the way from 2008:
Arizona Seeing Signs of Flight by Immigrants
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/12/us/12arizona.html
I agree we need comprehensive immigration reform. and if there's any upside to sb1070 I hope it will be to help force the feds to take action.
2010/5/18 keith smith <
klsmith2020@yahoo.com>
More misinformation. We have had 3 or 4 police officers killed by Illegals in the recent past. Phoenix is the kidnap capital of the WORLD. Most of the kidnaps, tortures, and murders are illegals.
I called ICE and they told me they estimate there are about 500,000 illegals in Phoenix. That means there is a MILLION! As a police officer I saw plenty of violence - rape, knifings, shootings, and homicides perpetrated by illegals.
Just because the crime rate is not rising means nothing. It means that if 25% of the homicides are perpetrated by illegals and nothing changes we have the same crime level.
It is being reported that half of all homicides in LA are perpetrated by Illegals.
Last year I talked with a Border Patrolman who worked on the border by Nogales. He said it was no man's land. Are
you hearing about the gun battles on the border. No you are not. You have no idea what is happening right here in our own community.
If you want the truth turn off your TV and start reading the blogs. The real truth is our there.
------------------------
Keith Smith
--- On Mon, 5/17/10, Ariel Gold <
arielqgold@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Ariel Gold <
arielqgold@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: OT ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
To: "Main PLUG discussion list" <
plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 11:40 PM
Sure, some of the radical rhetoric, on both sides, sounds scary, and I understand people are upset and angry. While I don't think a listserv lends to people understanding each other on a volatile issue like this, I thought I'd still share this link from the conservative think tank, the Cato Institute.
Misguided Fears of Crime Fuel Arizona Immigration Law
http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2010/04/27/misguided-fears-of-crime-fuel-arizona-immigration-law/
2010/5/17 Bryan O'Neal <
Bryan.ONeal@theonealandassociates.com>
Indeed I did ;)
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:01 PM, Tim Noeding <
tim.noeding@gmail.com> wrote:
> Flame wars? Really? Did you all read that linux magazine article about how
> the editor thinks they are enjoyable reads?
>
> from my DROID
>
> On May 17, 2010 9:41 PM, "Bryan O'Neal"
> <Bryan.ONeal@theonealandassociates.com> wrote:
>
> Did you not even read you cited references? It is more like if I
> called your mama fat beat you up and then drove off down the street in
> your car after tossing you a few bucks and a pick of your naked sister
> out the window onto your limp body and then when the cops showed up
> made you say thank you and apologize for wasting my time ;)
>
> Not that I am complaining. I think it was a bold move that paid off
> very, very, well. But denying the nature of the conflict is like
> saying the Civil War was fought over slavery. It is fine for your Jr.
> High text book but when grow, otherwise intelligent, people try
> spouting that stuff they are either American idiots or just don't
> care.
>
> To quote from the wikipidia page you cited.
>
> "The Mexican–American War was an armed conflict between the United
> States and Mexico from 1846 to 1848 in the wake of the 1845 U.S.
> annexation of Texas, which Mexico considered part of its territory
> despite the 1836 Texas Revolution.
>
> In addition to a naval blockade of the Mexican coast, American forces
> invaded and conquered New Mexico, California and parts of northern
> Mexico. Another American army captured Mexico City, forcing Mexico to
> agree to the sale of its northern territories to the U.S."
>
> On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:47 PM, JD Austin <jd@twingeckos.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Mon, May 17, 2010 at...
>
>> ---------------------------------------------------
>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lis...
>
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