****Re: Geek/Tech/Entrepreneur Stuff to do in PHX

Mon Aug 10 12:57:39 MST 2009

I just dealt with my dad dying and going through the VA Medical system
as a Veteran - all I can say is atrocious.  Myself and family literally
saw them KILL 2 other people around him at the VA accidentally in the
span of 3 weeks there, and being government they have no accountability
for their actions.  My father was was misdiagnosed for 2 years having
kidney problems, and ultimately was prostate cancer, but trying to treat
his kidneys managed to kill both of them dead.  By the time someone
competent (in ER) found out the real deal, he was already stage
4/terminal, died less than 2 months later.

His doctor was his same doctor for the past 30 years, and all he ever
wanted to do was pump pain meds into him, never actually *fixing*
anything.  The doctor was simply complacent and overall incompetent,
which is scary because customer advocacy quoted him as "one of their
best doctors".  Mostly we saw half-assed doctors that we had to lead
ourselves to certain conclusions, resident medical students that
couldn't tell a catheter from a lollypop, and overall the system
generally required us as family to constantly escalating within
management to do ANYTHING to help him.

... and this is what we want to do with health care in general?  No
thanks, I'd rather just slit my wrists now.

-mb

On Mon, 2009-08-10 at 12:13 -0700, Taylor, Kaia wrote:
> As an ex-Canadian, I can give you several specific personal examples of why moving towards the Canadian more socialist health care model is NOT desirable. (Eg I got tainted blood transfusions at the very same time that 2 hours drive away in New York state, the blood was being screened!)
> 
> As someone who knows a US vet, I can give you a specific example of why you should NOT TRUST the government to mess any more with your health care.  (eg his foot became infected with a diabetes-related issue, and he had to fight them to keep them from cutting it off!!!)
> 
> 
> 
> Kaia
> 
> 
> > > I agree our health care system is not as good as it
> > could be.  I worked for an HMO 12 years ago and saw it first hand.
> > > 
> > > We need freedom not restriction.  We need to be
> > free of the current model of health care.  I feel the model is 
> > alternative health care backed by a indemnity health insurance plan.  
> > A plan that lets you go to the doctor and pay them directly.  An 
> > insurance plan that makes you responsible for 20% of your charges.
> 
> ...
> 
> > backs and have government fund health care and let businesses stop 
> > paying the obscene amounts for health care. Taking the insurance 
> 
> Regards,
> Kaia Taylor
> 
> DevSA  group  --  tis-dco-devsa - jumpword devsa
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> 
> --- On Sun, 8/2/09, Craig White <craigwhite at azapple.com> wrote:
> 
> > From: Craig White <craigwhite at azapple.com>
> > Subject: Re: ****Re: Geek/Tech/Entrepreneur Stuff to do in PHX
> > To: "Main PLUG discussion list" 
> > <plug-discuss at lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
> > Date: Sunday, August 2, 2009, 6:21 PM
> > On Sun, 2009-08-02 at 17:33 -0700,
> > keith smith wrote:
> > > 
> > > So pumping trillions of dollars into special interest
> > projects is how we save the economy.
> > > 
> > > Saving GM was about the democrat party buying
> > votes.  Look who owns GM now.  This is I did you a favor now you owe 
> > me a favor type of politics.
> > > 
> > > Not to mention this is more than likely
> > unconstitutional.  Have you read the constitution lately?  The federal 
> > government is allotted very little especially when you read the 10th 
> > Amendment.
> > > 
> > > I wonder if I get my credit card out and run it up to
> > the limit if I will end up better off?
> > > 
> > > The free market has not failed.  The government
> > has failed in trying to manage it and our money supply ECT.
> > > 
> > > Lets look at one simple sector of our economy.
> > The housing market.  The housing market is where the down turn in our 
> > economy started.  And it all was mostly in the Phoenix area.
> > > 
> > > Did you know the housing market is in a state of
> > recovery in Phoenix.  How would I know about this.  I am trying to buy 
> > a house.  While houses are at 30% - 50% lower in price now than 2 
> > years ago, houses are being bid on and competition has returned.  The 
> > government has had little to do with the recovery in the Phoenix 
> > housing market.  It has been through private investment.
> > > 
> > > One thing that has been neglected is that markets
> > adjust.  It is natural.  When the government gets involved the 
> > problems are exasperated and I believe will ultimately be made worse.
> > > 
> > > Hyper inflation is projected to be in our
> > future.
> > > 
> > > When I make statements about government needing to be
> > pruned to the tune of 85% all I have to do is look at the Arizona 
> > government that has grown 60% in the past 5 years.  60% in 5 years.
> > > 
> > > What is our state government doing today that we now
> > know that we were deprived of before 2004 ?
> > > 
> > > It has been said that Bush spent more during his
> > tenure than all the presidents before him combined. Obama is going to 
> > make what Bush spent look like pocket change.
> > > 
> > > This alone is an indicator that government need to be
> > timed back substantially.
> > > 
> > > Sales tax in California is now 9.75%.  Almost 10%
> > of everything bought in California is tax at one tenth.  That is 
> > outrageous.  And they are still having budget problems.
> > > 
> > > Talking about budgets, when we cannot balance our
> > budget government spending is out of control.
> > > 
> > > I believe that reducing taxes and the size and scope
> > of government will spur economic growth.
> > > 
> > > Let the people vote with their dollars.  Let them
> > own and carry guns, as long as they have proven to be responsible, let 
> > them eat cheese burgers if the choose, let them chose their doctor and 
> > their insurance plan.
> > > 
> > > I agree our health care system is not as good as it
> > could be.  I worked for an HMO 12 years ago and saw it first hand.
> > > 
> > > We need freedom not restriction.  We need to be
> > free of the current model of health care.  I feel the model is 
> > alternative health care backed by a indemnity health insurance plan.  
> > A plan that lets you go to the doctor and pay them directly.  An 
> > insurance plan that makes you responsible for 20% of your charges.
> > > 
> > > Lets un-handcuff our medical professionals so they can
> > do what they do best.
> > > 
> > > Lets un-handcuff our businesses.  You are self
> > employed.  How do you feel every quarter when you send in your taxes?  
> > I feel cheated.
> > > 
> > > I think freedom is the answer.  So did our
> > Founding Fathers. 
> > ----
> > you are all over the map.
> > 
> > The National Debt went from less than 2 trillion to over 10 trillion 
> > under Bush.
> > 
> > There's no suitable prediction for what the net effects of Obama's 
> > efforts will yield. The destruction of the world economy and a 
> > depression perhaps larger than that experienced in the 1930's was 
> > probably if the government had not stepped in and propped up some of 
> > these companies. If you have an argument to make about that, by all 
> > means make one. The fact is we printed money to fight an expensive war 
> > in Iraq that we couldn't afford and pumped up the economy on a false 
> > housing bubble that burst because there was no oversight over the 
> > lenders and the bundling of the loans. I personally lay this at Bush's 
> > feet.
> > 
> > Chicago is 10% sales tax
> > NY, NY is 9+% sales tax
> > by the time our own state government gets through, we will be above 9%
> > 
> > The freedom of which you speak is a platitude. It has no basis to the 
> > reality of our current economic conditions, all caused by lack of 
> > government oversight into lending and the bundling of the securities 
> > bundles created with these terrible lending practices. Free market is 
> > the problem not the solution.
> > 
> > If you want to spur economic growth, take the monkey off businesses 
> > backs and have government fund health care and let businesses stop 
> > paying the obscene amounts for health care. Taking the insurance 
> > companies out of the equation saves at least $400B annually. Then 
> > businesses can compete. Small businesses can no longer afford to 
> > purchase health care for their employees. It has become obscenely 
> > expensive.
> > 
> > Craig
> > 
> > 
> > --
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