****Re: guess what....

[Vaughn Treude]

Lisa Kachold wrote:
> On 7/30/09, JD Austin <jd at twingeckos.com> wrote:
>   
>> The 'other' model isn't working any better.  My wife works in an Urgent
>> Care; tons of Canadians come here to get the health care they need.  I think
>> the whole industry needs to be more competitive; most things in health care
>> shouldn't cost what they do.
>>
>>     
> Inefficiency in preventative care, diagnostics, errors in surgery, the
> truth is incredibly expensive.
>
> But just because Canadians come here for care doesn't mean it's not working.
>   
<rant>
If by "working", you mean the majority of Canadians people accept it, 
and even think it's a good thing, I suppose it is. They're just very 
lucky they have a "safety valve", that is, a large semi-free country 
whose borders are within 100 miles of 90% of their population. 
Single-payer is, IMHO, the biggest piece of economic foolishness ever 
devised. Let's give an absolute monopoly to the most inefficient, 
corrupt organization ever invented by humans (government.) As for the 
notion that socialized medicine is cheaper, I don't believe it for a 
second. Governments can shift their costs to other agencies; the 
Pentagon does it all the time. I assume, for example, the cost of having 
"premiums" collected by the CRA doesn't get counted in the balance 
sheet. Not to mention the fact that a huge portion of the overhead costs 
of private insurers in the US is red tape imposed by government 
bureaucracies.
Not that I'm necessarily endorsing the current system. There were a lot 
of good not-for-profit medical insurers in this country until Richard 
Nixon changed the tax laws, causing a massive takeover by greedy HMO's. 
I'd like to see a system of decentralized medical cooperatives with 
for-profit companies as a supplement.
BTW, I don't blame the immigrants, but I do blame the lawyers. :-)
</rant>

No offense, just my two cents. :-)
There, I feel so much better.
Vaughn

> That is much too simplistic.  Gain from insurance systems (or
> governments) is a terrible enforcer in a triangulated model.  I am
> unsure which is worse, human ignorance about medicine, or lack of
> intelligent analysis, process review and enforcement in all systems
> (beit science, IT or medicine).
>
> Humans must speak out and enforce through personal education, direct
> questioning,  and notification to the press (our clearing houses),
> which simply is not the American way.
>
> Just in my lifetime, the huge numbers of medical errors for me and
> mine are huge.  I am sure when someone survives an illness (that could
> have been prevented, treated or diagnosed 2 decades ago), while also
> surviving the additional near death medical errors, one likes to shape
> family and friends thinking toward miraculous "grace of god" rather
> than take up the often useless attorney attempts for change available
> through liability.
>
> However, our medical systems must be changed for profitability for
> local, national interests, and that must start with courts,
> legislation and social care.
>
> The time when our courts alone could work with free markets, sadly
> died with my father's era.
>
>
>   
>> On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 6:57 AM, Lisa Kachold
>> <lisakachold at obnosis.com>wrote:
>>
>>     
>>> Well, that is the American model?
>>>
>>> 1) Limited, inefficient and horrendously expensive health care (where
>>> are the majority of my high school peers? dead) which exists as part
>>> of the "insurance industry" (rather than the scientific and health
>>> industries [which are non-existent!]
>>> 2) Feeding frenzy of artifically exploding "value" and credit costs!
>>> 3) Little "economic traps" everywhere! (We so loved our Monopoly games
>>> as children?)
>>> 4) Drugs actually used for government profit, agrandized by modern
>>> media! See #1, where illness is not treated, so drugs become a common
>>> man's answers.
>>> 5) Alcohol that limits functioning and keeps people from developing
>>> extensive critical thought.
>>> 6) Lack of primary economic education (greater than the 6th grade level).
>>> 7) Open borders so we have more minions within the matrix!
>>>
>>> On 7/30/09, JD Austin <jd at twingeckos.com> wrote:
>>>       
>>>> I was waiting to see how long until racism was called :)
>>>> It is a fact that illegal immigration is costing Az and Ca plenty and
>>>> pointing that out doesn't make him hate filled or racist.  I don't blame
>>>> them for coming here... If I were them I'd do it too.  We need to remove
>>>>         
>>> the
>>>       
>>>> 'free' incentives that we can no longer afford to provide.  They're not
>>>>         
>>> the
>>>       
>>>> only demographic freeloading services; plenty of Americans game the
>>>>         
>>> system
>>>       
>>>> (generations!) to get a free ride too.
>>>>
>>>> Such a conversation doesn't belong on this list about Linux and
>>>>         
>>> technology.
>>>       
>>>> On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 6:27 AM, Craig White <craigwhite at azapple.com>
>>>>         
>>> wrote:
>>>       
>>>>> On Wed, 2009-07-29 at 22:33 -0700, Lyle Tuttle wrote:
>>>>>           
>>>>>> Perhaps you are looking at the wrong source.....we now have a $3
>>>>>> Billion deficit.....check out these numbers in bold blue.........
>>>>>>             
>>>>> ----
>>>>> every state has a major deficit as they clearly were unprepared for
>>>>> such
>>>>> a drastic change in the economy.
>>>>>
>>>>> I find it offensive in every way that first JMZ linked the racist
>>>>> article and now you found it worthy to paste. The article is not a news
>>>>> story but rather an opinion piece and not really suitable for this
>>>>> list.
>>>>>
>>>>> That anyone should scapegoat any group of people (not once but many
>>>>> times) for causing this economic downturn is stupid. This is a bitter,
>>>>> hate filled person and his comments have no place on this list.
>>>>>
>>>>> Craig
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
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>>>>>
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>>>>>           
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>>>
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>
>
>