I read chip maker TSMC is a sweatshop

[techlists at phpcoderusa.com]

I asked the question because most of the advances in the world seem to 
have come from the good ol USA.  And who pays for this?  Taxpayers.

Years ago I was at a Christian men's meeting and the speaker said we 
should pay for ourselves first.  At first that struck me as odd.  Then 
he went on to say that we must survive and do well so those who are 
dependent on us will survive and do well.

Taking care of oneself first is a good concept.  If I crash and burn so 
does everything that depends on me.  It is not selfish is is pure 
wisdom.

I studied Just-in-Time (JIT) in college 34 years ago. Two things 
happened over the years.  We off shored the manufacturing of goods 
Americans want.  Two, we tighten up the JIT system too much, which has 
caused shortages.

I have a special interest in off shore production.  I'm talking about 
medicine.  It is my understanding that a lot of our pharmaceuticals are 
made in China.  The would is polarized. What happens if China become 
even more hostile towards the U.S.?

I think we need to get our own house in order then we will be better 
prepared to help others. And yes I do think we should help those who are 
less fortunate than us, but not at our expense.  If America crashed the 
world will follow.




On 2023-06-07 16:11, James Mcphee wrote:
> TMSC buys their lithography stuff out of ... the netherlands?  I
> think.  The chip designs are mostly US or UK (whatever ARM is these
> days).  The supply chain for that stuff is all over the world though.
> Mostly shipped to China, refined to an intermediate material, then
> usable in the higher end processes.  These are broad sweeps, of
> course.
> 
> H1B visas are a good idea if we're trying to raise a nation into being
> part of the global supply chain.  So I get that.  These days though,
> they mostly just compete with our labor.  There's definitely some
> argument for a small amount, sure.  But if it drives down our own
> labor prices?  Do we not have a right to first-serve to our own labor
> market?  Sigh.  I mean, at least commit to a path to citizenship so we
> can benefit from the training we dump into people.  Unless, like I
> said, our idea is to raise the capabilities of a country to make it
> able to participate in the global market on their own.  We pay for it,
> but it's better to have more options out there.
> 
> I dunno, there's lots of layers to it.  One way to look at it is
> purely labor market, where any form of foreign labor is direct
> competitor to us, which lowers our own wages, and is effectively a
> form of redistribution.  Another is on a geopolitics front, where
> we're effectively buying leverage over other countries and paying for
> their advancement.  Another is at the business level, where it's an
> opportunity to increase the labor pool, which drives down wages paid
> out.  Which means products produced here are more competitive.
> 
> On Wed, Jun 7, 2023 at 3:29 PM <techlists at phpcoderusa.com> wrote:
> 
>> On 2023-06-07 13:59, James Mcphee via PLUG-discuss wrote:
>>> Generally, if I hear it from cable news, there's a good chance
>> it's
>>> just someone drumming up support for something.  In this case,
>> we'll
>>> probably hear about some kind of H1B system to make sure the new
>> fabs
>>> get all the people they need, etc.  Same deal as when I was
>> working at
>>> a company that got bought by Dell, and they failed to retain most
>> of
>>> the new employees because they didn't have a structure that worked
>>> with professionals.  Suddenly you saw Michael Dell doing an
>> interview
>>> on CNBC about the need to extend H1B 'cause they aren't getting
>> enough
>>> workers.  At the very least, there's plenty of incentive to drive
>> down
>>> labor costs.  And with the halts for new housing going out, there
>> is a
>>> LOT of incentive to manipulate the market.
>>> 
>>> Am I being paranoid?  I probably need to touch more grass.
>> 
>> Are you getting too paranoid?  Maybe not.  I quit following the news
>> 
>> because I think most are fearmongering and not talking and working
>> on
>> the real problems.
>> 
>> I personally do not like the H1B visas because I do not think they
>> are
>> necessary. If there is really a shortage of tech workers then why is
>> 
>> there not a few major tech universities?  Why does Gates exploit the
>> H1B
>> and not create a really great tech university?  And why do the
>> politicians allow all of this?
>> 
>> We have all we need right here in our 50 states, so why do we not do
>> 
>> things that benefit ourselves and possibly others?
>> 
>> These people like Michael Dell, Bill Gates, etc have forgotten where
>> 
>> they came from.
>> 
>> QUESTION?
>> 
>> I understand TSMC produces the most chips in the world, and is
>> located
>> in Taiwan .  Where did they get that technology and who paid for
>> that
>> technology?
>> 
>>> 
>>> On Wed, Jun 7, 2023 at 1:15 PM Jim via PLUG-discuss
>>> <plug-discuss at lists.phxlinux.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Don't believe everything you read on the internet.  I've read
>> that
>>>> Abraham Lincoln blames Donald Trump for giving the gun to John
>>>> Wilkes Booth.
>>>> 
>>>> On 6/6/23 17:45, Keith Smith via PLUG-discuss wrote:
>>>>> Chip maker TSMC is moving to chandler and I have read they are a
>>>>> sweatshop....
>>>>> 
>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list: PLUG-discuss at lists.phxlinux.org
>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>>> https://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list: PLUG-discuss at lists.phxlinux.org
>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>> https://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>> 
>>> --
>>> James McPhee
>>> jmcphe at gmail.com
>>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list: PLUG-discuss at lists.phxlinux.org
>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>> https://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> 
> --
> James McPhee
> jmcphe at gmail.com