Phoenix Linux History

[Alan Dayley]

"and recent request from Alan Dayley not to discuss MPGLUG and DeVry
Hackfesting on the Discussion and Security lists)."

My request was unclear. I am sorry for that. Let me clarify.

I do NOT want event announcements from other groups to stop. Please
announce events in the PLUG lists.

I DO want veiled arguments and attacks in such announcements to stop. There
are so many Linux users and professionals in Phoenix that there is no need
to disrespect any other group in order to build your own.

Lastly, I have no power of policy making in PLUG at all. My request is from
me, as a person who dislikes unproductive conflict.

Alan

On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 12:47 PM Lisa Desperation <desperategirl at gmx.com>
wrote:

> A good study of history, resource allocation and competition provides
> clarity to set policy and provide fair open source choices.
>
> Please see the following message from Lisa Kachold (who started the
> Hackfests with PLUG in 2008 [now associated with MPGLUG and in good
> standing at DeVry University] which was censored from the PLUG MAILMAN
> Discussion Lists related to removal of the Hackfests from the PLUG Calendar
> (and recent request from Alan Dayley not to discuss MPGLUG and DeVry
> Hackfesting on the Discussion and Security lists).
>
> There is a great deal of "gossip" strangely in this Linux community, with
> outrageous claims that the "hackfests were thrown out of Ganglank for
> hacking" (patently untrue [we are West Phoenix residents unhappy with
> commuting to Chandler]), so it's incredibly important to evaluate the
> "actual words" of individuals.
>
> For instance, we compare Todd Cole's admission of removing the Hackfests
> from the schedule against resource use events in context.  DeVry
> University's donated OneNeck rack use by AZLOCO was pulled because of lack
> of student involvement or direct campus meetings (after the DeVry DLUG
> student David Huerta graduated and the DLUG disbanded) whereupon Hackfests
> were given exclusive control over the rack and public IPs (where the AZLOCO
> Big Blue Button server had been located).
>
> All linux user groups are healthy because of the historic willingness of
> all members to GROW and INCLUDE discussion and sister community venues, not
> censor or remove discussion and facts:
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Lisa Kachold
> Date: Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 9:47 PM
> Subject: Fwd: plug calendar
>
> Thanks Todd for your mail describing your direct role in the decision to
> drop the 8 year old Hackfests from the PLUG calendar (excerpted below).  I
> really wish you or Hans or another PLUG member would have contacted me
> either to state this decision or brainstorm a solution.
> I understand that you have fostered bad feelings after DeVry University's
> management requested that David Demland (and I) verify the student use of
> the  donated rack at OneNeck, which actually was not used at all for
> anything but the AZLoco Big Blue Button server that you inherited after
> their (student managed) DLUG  was left without leadership (due to
> graduation) and disbanded.   Since AZLoco had no school relationship or
> student interaction, it was suggested that we give you a chance to either
> relocate your servers or begin working closely with the Hackfests or
> another student or University involved open source event, as their rules
> require.  You chose instead, to quickly remove your servers and limit all
> communication with me, which previously was regular, cooperative and
> productive.
> Unfortunately the PLUG Discuss List has failed to recognize the great
> contribution the Hackfest provides to the community, to our interns and
> DeVry/ITT students, and the value the open source security contributors and
> professional linux community members have added through the last 8 years
> interacting and supporting the Hackfest.
> People attempting to attend the Hackfests complained because they couldn't
> get into the DeVry University campus without instructions which we were
> repeatedly unsuccessful getting posted on the PLUG Schedule.  DeVry is a
> closed secure campus, and the office volunteers often don't know what event
> is happening when.  Posting signs is also limited by school facility
> security rules, and without detailed instructions on the PLUG schedule our
> attendance suffered.  We have NEVER missed a venue or a scheduled event
> (especially not in the last 5 years [since you became active in the Plug
> Schedule after you were asked to relinquish sole use of the OneNeck rack
> (or become involved directly with DeVry students).  Again we have failed
> repeatedly over the years with our requests to get the Hackfest listing
> specifics on the PLUG schedule.  Our posts to the PLUG announce mailing
> lists, and security have always gone out (or been sent) days before the
> event and included instructions to either call 2 phone numbers for (David
> Demland and/or I) or trade an ID at the office for an access badge to come
> to room #231.  I was alerted that no announcements were being sent, but
> assumed that the PLUG was operated in a professional way, and if there was
> an issue, I would be contacted.  No announcements came to a second address
> I use for test email which is also subscribed to all the email lists, so
> when I finally found time between professional endeavors (IBM/Dell/local
> current International security firm Sr. Systems Administration role) I
> began to investigate.
> We always have at least 10 community people (in addition to students) but
> usually total attendance tops around 25 filling the lab where we use DeVry
> desktop stations to demonstrate Kali Linux.  This is a healthy venue that
> will be continuing with one of the  other local Users Groups and David
> Demland, Tim Garcia (ITT),  and the many other professionals contributing
> presentations and suggestions.
> I believe you are misreading the user complaints about the Hackfest which
> were actually a complaint of the lack of instructions posted on the
> schedule, for which you had the ability to effect.  This is a terrible
> failure of a LUG process when actually all that would have been required to
> make it more successful would have been the addition of a good description
> of  access procedures to DeVry University including my very public phone
> number on the PLUG schedule.
> I have directed all of our attendees not to target either AZLoco or the
> PhxLinux.org sites because of this controversy and long running conflict,
> despite the fact that most CMS are trivially exploitable with the practical
> tools and procedures we demonstrate at Hackfests in lab environments.
> --Best
> Original Email:
> from: Todd Cole <Todd>
> to: Lisa Kachold <someone>
> date: Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 6:47 PM
> subject: plug calendar
>
> Lisa
> I no longer mail to plug list so I apologize on the delay and private
> email.
>  Some of the things you have posted are in fact due to me.  Several years
> ago there were many errors in the plug calendar and the loco was a bit more
> accurate. Hans now has kids and a family and Brian has a kid and full time
> job and the calendar was sadly not kept up. I offered loco dates by feed at
> first and then last year we went to a full feed from loco calendar. This
> has been difficult to word events and top billing and whose name should be
> first. There have been several volunteers that have started to maintain the
> plug calendar but both have dropped it after minutes of updating events. As
> of right now no one is maintaining the plug calendar and several broken
> feeds and events some new, some wrong.
> I have dropped the Hackfest from azloco calendar due to many complaints
> several years ago of people showing up at events and finding no one there
> and no note or notice of a cancelled event. Since you have moved to Devry I
> was still getting a few calls that they could not locate or contact you at
> an event and or people were at a event felt totally lost. I can understand
> that your projects are not for a total noob or a basic user so after
> discussions with plug and the loco it was decided not to promote Hackfest
> at this time. If and when I get positive comments I will be happy to
> reconsider for the loco end and I cannot speak for the plug side
>
> <end excerpt>
>
>
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