OT: NSA story keeps getting bigger...

Fri Jun 7 07:21:20 MST 2013

The Federal Government is not going to go quietly.  The Gov may get to the point of stopping you from "checking out" of their game.

Did you know a judge ruled you cannot eat anything you grow without the Gov's permission?

If they do not like what you are doing they can just put you in a FEMA camp or prison.

As it stand now they Gov can label anyone an enemy combatant and hold them indefinitely with no due process or habeas corpus.  

All they have to do is define enemy combatant as anyone who is against the Gov and  everyone who has responded to this thread would be subject to indefinite detention.

------------------------

Keith Smith

--- On Thu, 6/6/13, Patrick Callahan <patrick.pxc.c at gmail.com> wrote:

From: Patrick Callahan <patrick.pxc.c at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: OT: NSA story keeps getting bigger...
To: "Main PLUG discussion list" <plug-discuss at lists.phxlinux.org>
Date: Thursday, June 6, 2013, 9:52 PM

As it happens, I'm an atheist. I, at least, am not offended, although I am a bit surprised. That did seem to come out of nowhere.

Anarchy is actually something I kind of hope for, although not classical, naive ‘state of nature’ anarchy. I'd like to think there are collective forms of self-regulation which can work in combination to provide some of the same functions as a state but do not constitute one.

I'm not convinced that the ingredients are all there, but there are a lot of things lately that make me hopeful for a slow transition into a kind of crypto-anarchy. With the democratization of manufacturing conveyed by 3D printing, the presence of increasingly pervasive supranational computer networks, strong encryption, and finally the ability to trade without the approval of a state or the presence of a central mint (i.e., Bitcoin and other crypto-currencies), we may be able to do a lot of important things without having to give the state much say in it. If projects like Bitcoin, Distributed Defense, and The Open Source Ecology Project take off, we may see the very concept of the modern state reduced to something humbler.

On Thu, Jun 6, 2013 at 9:08 PM, Nathan England <nathan at nmecs.com> wrote:

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On 6/6/2013 8:06 PM, Patrick Callahan wrote:

> I was in the 3rd grade when the Twin Towers fell. We've been at war

> for what feels like my entire life. We've been chasing after

> 'terrorism' as long as I can remember. I've never gotten onto an

> airplane without having to deal with the TSA. I was born into the

> age of the PATRIOT Act. There used to be a time when they couldn't

> just take you to Gitmo? What is America like? I sometimes feel like

> I've never been.

>

> I know the freedom and justice have always been matters of

> struggle, and here in the US not much of either were afforded to

> many minorities for a long time. In some important ways, especially

> in terms of equality, things are better than they've ever been.

> Still, this kind of news makes me feel so powerless and

> indifferent, and it's all I've been hearing my whole life. I'm so

> sick of it. I loathe the 'post-9/11 world' that has been my

> environment since childhood.

>

You know, as a street preacher and believer of the bible, I pray for

situations and responses as yours. What an incredible open door! What

is really interesting is I believe there is a generation of kids and

young adults who are entering society right this moment who have never

heard of Jesus Christ, some may call that progress, naturally I do not.

While I may have turned off a lot of people in that one paragraph, my

intention is not to begin preaching about Christ, but rather to point

out that a book that was written thousands of years ago suggested a

time such as this would come. Scoffers will scoff and have a myriad of

reasons why anyone could have made such a prediction, but as I believe

the bible, I believe it teaches many people will feel exactly as you

just suggested right now. I believe the bible teaches that in the end

times, which I believe we are, people will be confused, not knowing

which way to turn, people will be crying out for answers, people will

be almost desperate to find something comforting because of the choas

around them. I believe this chaotic, confused, claustrophobic

environment is exactly what the devil wants to create so when the

person the bible refers to as the antichrist shows up and says peace

peace, people will be begging for more.

Whether you agree with anything I've said, believe it or not, we live

in interesting times. Many would say we are progressing, yet progress

implies things are changing for the better. They do not say we are

"digressing". Progress implies change for good. Yet look around,

things are not getting better. The only possible outcomes for what we

see happening right now are: 1) revolution, which will lead to war. 2)

Loss of all liberties as a police state is created. 3) Anarchy, which

I believe would be different than revolution, which would likely lead

to multiple factions creating multiple police states.

All of which lead to a time of no peace. A time of extreme bondage. A

time that some would refer to, even now, as "wars and rumors of wars".

I hope I have not offended anyone, but I appreciate the open door you

left me Patrick! Thank you!

Nathan

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