Exploitation?
Nathan England
nathan at paysonlinux.org
Wed Apr 27 18:30:34 MST 2011
Maybe they understand exactly that they get what they pay for, and want
someone like Keith is explaining, which is why they called it a "junior
admin" job to begin with...
On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 1:43 PM, keith smith <klsmith2020 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I think that is my point. They may find someone who has skills but no
> record. The new employee spends a year with this company and then leaves
> because he/she now has a year of documented sys admin experience.
>
> Entry level training ground.
>
> ------------------------
> Keith Smith
>
> --- On *Wed, 4/27/11, Bryan O'Neal <Bryan.ONeal at TheONealAndAssociates.com>
> * wrote:
>
>
> From: Bryan O'Neal <Bryan.ONeal at TheONealAndAssociates.com>
> Subject: Re: Exploitation?
> To: "Main PLUG discussion list" <plug-discuss at lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
> Date: Wednesday, April 27, 2011, 1:13 PM
>
>
> That is a quality counter argument. The next question is do people
> understand they get what they pay for...
>
> On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 11:20 AM, keith smith <klsmith2020 at yahoo.com<http://mc/compose?to=klsmith2020@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
>
> In the past I would have been upset with such an offering. What I see now
> is a pathway. While none of us like to see a sys admin job for $10 -
> $12/hr, most folks would not apply. If this position helps someone move
> from retail sales, delivering pizza, working at Fry's grocery, ETC. Then
> this position has value by providing someone a pathway into what they might
> really like to be doing.
>
> I would imagine whomever takes a position like this will stay just long
> enough to build a resume that will allow them to move to the next level.
>
> ------------------------
> Keith Smith
>
> --- On *Wed, 4/27/11, Bryan O'Neal <Bryan.ONeal at TheONealAndAssociates.com>
> * wrote:
>
>
> From: Bryan O'Neal <Bryan.ONeal at TheONealAndAssociates.com>
>
> Subject: Re: Exploitation?
> To: "Main PLUG discussion list" <plug-discuss at lists.plug.phoenix.az.us<http://mc/compose?to=plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
> >
> Date: Wednesday, April 27, 2011, 8:48 AM
>
>
> Commentary on the Linux job market seems entirely on topic to me. But
> that, is just one mans opinion.
> What surprised me is the lack of people countering lisa's argument
> with hard examples of how the market has not been comoditised to the
> point of removing any since of humanity from the common offering.
>
> On 4/25/11, James Finstrom <jfinstrom at rhinoequipment.com<http://mc/compose?to=jfinstrom@rhinoequipment.com>>
> wrote:
> > It already has gone off list someone is abusing their email list. That
> being
> > said my original reply was within the bounds of the discussion if we are
> > taking that approach but the personal attack to my email is
> > what escalated it. We will simply agree to disagree but abuse of users
> off
> > list is not acceptable PERIOD!
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 2:33 PM, Stephen <cryptworks at gmail.com<http://mc/compose?to=cryptworks@gmail.com>>
> wrote:
> >
> >> ok this really needs to go off list..
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 2:27 PM, James Finstrom <
> >> jfinstrom at rhinoequipment.com<http://mc/compose?to=jfinstrom@rhinoequipment.com>>
> wrote:
> >>
> >>> LOL I am not the one off topic but I am at fault as everyone knows
> your
> >>> 256 shades of bat*** crazy and I made the mistake of pointing it out. I
> >>> assume you will take your meds and not hurt yourself or anyone else for
> >>> my
> >>> mistake....
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 2:22 PM, Lisa Kachold
> >>> <lisakachold at obnosis.com<http://mc/compose?to=lisakachold@obnosis.com>
> >wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> James,
> >>>>
> >>>> I accept your apology for the PLUG.
> >>>>
> >>>> Have a better day.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 1:51 PM, James Finstrom <
> >>>> jfinstrom at rhinoequipment.com<http://mc/compose?to=jfinstrom@rhinoequipment.com>>
> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> I am sure It would have been acceptable as a straight relay of the
> job.
> >>>>> What was off topic was the personal commentary to the posters
> >>>>> intentions and
> >>>>> motivations ie: the subject of this email
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 8:57 AM, Lisa Kachold
> >>>>> <lisakachold at obnosis.com<http://mc/compose?to=lisakachold@obnosis.com>
> >wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 8:53 AM, keith smith
> >>>>>> <klsmith2020 at yahoo.com <http://mc/compose?to=klsmith2020@yahoo.com>
> >wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I don't think this is a " Jr cabling/desktop monkey" job. The job
> >>>>>>> post says "...This position is 90% remote...".
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I think this is a start up and the owner has everyone work out of
> >>>>>>> their home to keep the cost down and they meet at his house.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> About 12 years ago I worked for a consulting company. I was W2 and
> >>>>>>> worked from home. He provided my computer, pay, limited benefits,
> >>>>>>> and he
> >>>>>>> worked out of his home. By doing business this way he was able to
> >>>>>>> keep the
> >>>>>>> cost of doing business to a minimum. I believe he started on a
> shoe
> >>>>>>> string
> >>>>>>> and just stayed there.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I believe this is an opportunity for someone to learn, grow, and
> get
> >>>>>>> some resume material.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> ------------------------
> >>>>>>> Keith Smith
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> --- On *Mon, 4/25/11, Kevin Fries <kfries6 at gmail.com<http://mc/compose?to=kfries6@gmail.com>>*
> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> From: Kevin Fries <kfries6 at gmail.com<http://mc/compose?to=kfries6@gmail.com>
> >
> >>>>>>> Subject: Re: Exploitation?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> To: "Main PLUG discussion list" <
> >>>>>>> plug-discuss at lists.plug.phoenix.az.us<http://mc/compose?to=plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
> >
> >>>>>>> Date: Monday, April 25, 2011, 7:31 AM
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I am not sure I would go directly to exploitation. Though I would
> >>>>>>> say
> >>>>>>> they are trying to take advantage slightly. All the requirements
> are
> >>>>>>> 1-3
> >>>>>>> years. I would assume there is already in place a full admin, so
> >>>>>>> this
> >>>>>>> person would likely be a Jr cabling/desktop monkey. Here in Denver
> >>>>>>> that job
> >>>>>>> would go for 40-45k a year and our tech job market is much stronger
> >>>>>>> than
> >>>>>>> yours. I lost my job the last day of September last year and
> started
> >>>>>>> my job
> >>>>>>> search Oct 1... started a new job Nov 15th, and I was not the first
> >>>>>>> to find
> >>>>>>> one... but that is Denver. Phoenix is a much tougher nut. So
> while
> >>>>>>> the
> >>>>>>> rates are low, and probably not very realistic, I think
> exploitation
> >>>>>>> is a
> >>>>>>> bit strong. I bet they find some nice kid 20-22 years old in the
> >>>>>>> $15-$18
> >>>>>>> range.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Kevin
> >>>>>>> On Apr 25, 2011 7:54 AM, "Lisa Kachold"
> >>>>>>> <lisakachold at obnosis.com<http://mc/compose?to=lisakachold@obnosis.com>
> <http://mc/compose?to=lisakachold@obnosis.com>>
> >>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>> > Anyone seen this:
> >>>>>>> http://phoenix.craigslist.org/nph/sad/2341174027.html
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>> > --excerpt--
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>> > COMPANY is now hiring a Linux / Windows Systems Admin. This is a
> >>>>>>> > Jr.
> >>>>>>> Admin
> >>>>>>> > role. We are looking for a energetic person who has a basic
> >>>>>>> background in
> >>>>>>> > administration. This position is 90% remote but you must reside
> in
> >>>>>>> the
> >>>>>>> > Phoenix area due to weekly meetings. Please see below for skill
> >>>>>>> > set.
> >>>>>>> Please
> >>>>>>> > do not apply if you are a seasoned admin this is a Jr. positions.
> >>>>>>> Pay rate
> >>>>>>> > is $10 - $12.50 an hour.
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>> > Windows Administration - 1 to 3 years
> >>>>>>> > Linux Administration - 1 to 3 years
> >>>>>>> > Networking - 1 to 3 years
> >>>>>>> > UNIX - is a plus
> >>>>>>> > Programing - is a plus
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>> > * Location: Phoenix Area
> >>>>>>> > * Compensation: $10 - $12.50
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>> > CRITICAL THOUGHT:
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>> > 1) How can you require all the same responsibilities in a
> so-called
> >>>>>>> Junior
> >>>>>>> > Systems Admin of a regular admin as a rationalization to only pay
> >>>>>>> them
> >>>>>>> > $12-15 an hour?
> >>>>>>> > 2) This company is clearly not a .ORG - seems they have
> >>>>>>> mis-registered their
> >>>>>>> > domain name?
> >>>>>>> > 3) Don't even sec scan their website...
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>> > But hey, if you want to work from home, this might be a good gig,
> >>>>>>> you can
> >>>>>>> > work 15 minutes on the hour!
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>> > --
> >>>>>>> > (503) 754-4452 iPhone
> >>>>>>> > (623) 239-3392 Skype
> >>>>>>> > (623) 688-3392 Google Voice
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>> > http://www.it-clowns.com
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>> > "It took me many years but I have gained access to the root
> account
> >>>>>>> and have
> >>>>>>> > removed the user God." -Saros
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Yes, I think this could be a good gig.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> We don't have a job posts area anymore or I would have laid her
> there.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> (503) 754-4452 iPhone
> >>>>>> (623) 239-3392 Skype
> >>>>>> (623) 688-3392 Google Voice
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> http://www.it-clowns.com
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> "It took me many years but I have gained access to the root account
> >>>>>> and
> >>>>>> have removed the user God." -Saros
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss at lists.plug.phoenix.az.us<http://mc/compose?to=PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
> >>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >>>>>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> James Finstrom
> >>>>> Rhino Equipment Corp.
> >>>>> http://rhinoequipment.com
> >>>>> Phone: 1-877-RHINO-T1
> >>>>> Twitter: http://twitter.com/rhinoequipment
> >>>>> Facebook: http://facebook.com/RhinoEquipment
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ---------------------------------------------------
> >>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss at lists.plug.phoenix.az.us<http://mc/compose?to=PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
> >>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >>>>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> (503) 754-4452 iPhone
> >>>> (623) 239-3392 Skype
> >>>> (623) 688-3392 Google Voice
> >>>>
> >>>> http://www.it-clowns.com
> >>>>
> >>>> "It took me many years but I have gained access to the root account
> and
> >>>> have removed the user God." -Saros
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------
> >>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss at lists.plug.phoenix.az.us<http://mc/compose?to=PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
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> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ---------------------------------------------------
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> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> >> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
> >>
> >> Stephen
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------
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> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > James Finstrom
> > Rhino Equipment Corp.
> > http://rhinoequipment.com
> > Phone: 1-877-RHINO-T1
> > Twitter: http://twitter.com/rhinoequipment
> > Facebook: http://facebook.com/RhinoEquipment
> >
>
> --
> Sent from my mobile device
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> -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
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--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Nathan England
I believe in the Constitution and the 4th Amendment. I am innocent and have
nothing to hide, but NO agent of the state crosses my threshhold without a
valid warrant signed by a judge and properly submitted. If we fail to
exercise our rights, we lose them.
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