On 2024-11-04 11:30, David Schwartz via PLUG-discuss wrote:
> Not what anybody wants to hear but …
>
> AI is going to transform this thing we call “programming”.
>

It has already.  I use it regularly.  It helped me configure my LAMP
server to use php-fpm.  I've played with enough to know it can program
faster than me and better than me.



> The “programming” process is going to become more high-level and
> abstract. The “coding" stuff will become hidden in the background and
> nobody will care about the language being used.

For now I think one needs senior experience to use AI for programming. 
Maybe 3 50 5 years it might be getting there.  I think we are safe for
possibly 10 more years.

>
> Descriptions of what’s wanted will be used instead of entering lines
> and lines of code.
>
> I see a process that looks more like an interview, like what analysts
> do now, where the user is describing what they want to see first at the
> UI level, then drilling down to specific formulas and actions that
> apply to each field, as well as what back-end sources and destinations
> of data exist.

I agree.

>
> For a while, that will be done by us “programmers”, but as it gets
> better, it will be done with an increasing amount of input directly
> from users or “analysts” who do that stuff now.
>
> This is going to shift the nature of work we do, but I doubt it’ll
> change things significantly for several years because most people
> cannot think through things in a stepwise logical manner.
>
> Also, most people can’t look at things from a “big picture
> perspective”, which means they’re going to get really annoyed at the
> interview process asking about stuff they think is irrelevant,
> resulting in overly narrow applications that cannot be easily adapted
> to deal with broader needs over time. (Yeah, so what’s new about that,
> right?)
>
> I know that learning to code is being seen as some kind of necessary
> skill today, but they’re a day late and a few dollars short. In a world
> where people can’t balance their checkbooks or track their spending,
> learning to code is never going to be more than a hobby. They’ll be
> turning to ChatGPT.

When I think about the AI programmer I still see testing analysis and
design and training.  I think most of this will eventually be taken over
by machines.... And I am glad I am old.  I figure I will retire in
another 10 years.

There is so much going on right now that the next 10 years should be
very interesting.

Keith

>
> We need a “CodeGPT” thingamabob that people can use to make apps.
>
> -David Schwartz
>
>
>
>
>> On Nov 4, 2024, at 10:47 AM, Keith Smith via PLUG-discuss
>> <plug-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Alexander,
>>
>> I'm a PHP developer and my audience on YouTube, I would guess, are
>> people wanting to learn PHP.
>>
>> I use Linux to support my PHP programming.
>>
>> I'm wondering if there is some value in not automating so one has to
>> do these tasks over and over.  I'm thinking this can help the learning
>> curve.
>>
>> I know I have learned a lot.  I last did this stuff on CentOS 6.x
>> maybe 5 or 6 years ago.  Ubuntu is similar but different.
>>
>> Your Thoughts?
>>
>> Keith
>>
>>
>> On 2024-10-22 15:34, Keith Smith via PLUG-discuss wrote:
>>> What is the learning curve for that?
>>> On 2024-10-22 15:09, Snyder, Alexander J wrote:
>>>> I think a lot of this could be made a lot easier with Ansible and
>>>> Jinja templates.
>>>> --
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Alexander
>>>> Sent from my Google Pixel 7 Pro
>>>> On Tue, Oct 22, 2024, 13:39 Keith Smith via PLUG-discuss
>>>> <plug-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org> wrote:
>>>>> Thank You Everyone!!
>>>>> Seems the problem was I needed to uncomment "PasswordAuthentication
>>>>> yes". When creating a user with SSH ability.
>>>>> Keith
>>>>> On 2024-10-22 10:46, Rusty Carruth via PLUG-discuss wrote:
>>>>>> ChatGPT gave a more complete answer than I do below (the question
>>>>> was:
>>>>>> This person is using vhost, and thinks he wants to chroot to the
>>>>>> docroot of the vhost when the user logs in. What do you think of
>>>>> that?)
>>>>>> (I never thought I'd be pointing people to an AI for answers! ;-)
>>>>>> On 10/22/24 10:42, Rusty Carruth via PLUG-discuss wrote:
>>>>>>> One thing I don't understand, below.
>>>>>>> On 10/22/24 10:25, Keith Smith via PLUG-discuss wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>> I appreciate all the feedback.  There is more to the story.
>>>>>>>> ....
>>>>>>>> The 3 things I think I need to accomplish:
>>>>>>>> 1) Add a user and configure it to use SSH.
>>>>>>>> 2) Configure each vhost to use PHP-FPM.
>>>>>>>> 3) Limit the User to the docroot of it's virtual host.
>>>>>>>> (ChrootDirectory)
>>>>>>> I don't understand # 3.  Let me say what I think you said:  you
>>>>> have
>>>>>>> (some number of) virtual machines.  Or do you mean that thing
>>>>> that
>>>>>>> allows you to run more than one web address from the same IP
>>>>> address?
>>>>>>> In either case, why do you need to chroot to docroot? You do
>>>>> realize
>>>>>>> that docroot must then have EVERYTHING the user needs - all
>>>>> programs,
>>>>>>> all devices, everything.  So you're going to need /dev, /bin,
>>>>>>> /usr/bin, and so forth or the user will be dead in the water with
>>>>> no
>>>>>>> commands - shoot, not even bash will be there to try to type
>>>>> commands!
>>>>>>> If you're doing the chroot already, and its failing, then that's
>>>>>>> probably because bash isn't there, nor is anything else you
>>>>> need...
>>>>>>>> I am using a clone of the LAMP server so I am going to remove it
>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> create another close and start by trying to create a use that
>>>>> has SSH
>>>>>>>> access and a home directory.
>>>>>>> If you are using virtual machines, just clone it in the virtual
>>>>>>> machine - but then, I'm thinking you don't mean virtual machine,
>>>>> you
>>>>>>> mean that other thing :-)
>>>>>>>> Then I think I should work on limiting that user to the vhost
>>>>> that is
>>>>>>>> designated to work with.
>>>>>>> So, if you mean not virtual machine but that other thing, then
>>>>> you're
>>>>>>> either going to have to copy all the stuff I talk about above in
>>>>> to
>>>>>>> the docroot tree (which I still think will cause more problems
>>>>> than it
>>>>>>> will fix), or mount the stuff above inside the docroot, or figure
>>>>> out
>>>>>>> how to change permissions and ownership so that the user can only
>>>>>>> change the stuff in their docroot.  Perhaps group ownership can
>>>>> save
>>>>>>> the day here, assuming you want ALL files in ALL web servers to
>>>>> be
>>>>>>> owned by whoever is running Apache, then create 2 or more groups,
>>>>>>> change all group ownership to the NON-User group, then
>>>>>>> change group ownership of all files in your docroot to the group
>>>>> of
>>>>>>> the user (obviously you're going to have to change the user to
>>>>> have
>>>>>>> that group too), then change permissions to something like 770
>>>>> for all
>>>>>>> directories everywhere (or 775, or whatever) and 660 for all
>>>>> files.
>>>>>>> Done, supposedly ;-)
>>>>>>>> Then finish up by installing configuring the vhost to use
>>>>> PHP-FPM.
>>>>>>>> Any thought are much appreciated!!
>>>>>>>> Keith
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