Lisa, to me, being someone who has a good relationship with PLUG and Hans, I feel that your post is offensive, not just to Hans, but to everyone who considers PLUG to be a positive influence for the greater metro Phoenix area. Can the functioning of PLUG be improved? Of course, like almost everything. I for my part appreciate the work PLUG (and by extension Hans) is doing, and given the demands of our individual lives, I believe it is commendable! Regarding your claims of sexual harassment, you might want to consider its definition (which, as you might now, governs the workplace). I found this link http://www.eeoc.gov/laws/types/sexual_harassment.cfm From the information I have, it seems unlikely that what you describe would qualify for sexual harassment! I think your post abundantly shows your displeasure with the way things are, and you don't have to repeat it any more. If you have such a low opinion of matters relating to PLUG, you always have the options to either branch out on your own, or find an organization with which you can have a better relationship. I wish you lots of success with the hackfest and other efforts you undertake, and I hope you are sufficiently motivated by their benefits, and can accept others making decisions about calendar entries that you disagree with. Walter On 11/30/2014 08:22 AM, Lisa Kachold wrote: > Hans/(All), > > PLUG (aka Hans [since actually no leadership was ever allowed] is > going to have to state the rules under which you are "dismissing" via > schedule removal a healthy regular popular venue. > > PLUG (aka Hans "Luft") is going to have to reference when those rules > were published and when they were delivered to me. > > EVERYONE has historically had their own website, because PLUG does not > allow: > > 1) Specific wording in announcements. > 2) Submitting additional announcements and extensive innovative content. > 3) Presentation postings. > > Examples of other historic users (in good standing) with their own > websites to support their presentations and community endeavors include: > > Ryan Rix > Alan Dayley > Joseph Sinclair > Brian Cluff > Alexander Henry > > The PLUG (lack of structure and rules/guidelines) consistent with > other cities of comparable sizes (specific examples are Seattle, Los > Angeles and Portland) has kept the group from becoming all that a LUG > can be. > > Older retired penguins have devoted thousands of hours and dollars > each year purchasing their own equipment for community venues like > Installfest without anyone in PLUG "leadership" even getting a 501(c)3 > rider under another PLUG to allow income tax relief. > > Here's a long list of past discussions that echo these limitations and > issues: > > http://208.77.223.83/lurker/message/20100205.085425.dbace92f.en.html > > http://208.77.223.83/lurker/message/20130508.020509.d70d1744.en.html > > http://208.77.223.83/lurker/message/20090806.163922.37c4d455.en.html > > http://208.77.223.83/lurker/message/20101108.063046.7219d889.en.html > > The ramifications of PLUG (aka Hans "Luft") limiting announcements and > venues (like the HackFest) that promote continuing educational schools > (other than Mesa Community College [where he has been adjunct > teacher]) are obvious. > > The ramifications of PLUG (aka Hans "Luft") "dropping" a 7 year > successful event like the HackFest is HUGE. > > I have been long contacted by members active for many years who want > support to backup recommendations to disband the PLUG (or remove > "Presidential dictatorship") with a long laundry list of reasons from > sexual harassment (Example: Hans raising his wedding ring clad finger > to women as they wait to speak with him about PLUG matters during > public community events [which I have experienced twice myself]) to > outright misuse of funding ( [tee shirts and donations from local > businesses] and PLUG interns/students raising money for sister project > ABLEConf) as well as inappropriate steering to classes at Mesa > Community College during "OpenSource" community venues. > > I have stayed out of escalation of those issues to other authorities, > but "Silence is DEATH" and a Linux Users Group where membership live > in threat of social ostracism and promote via "inner circle > relationships" (or make decisions like drop a healthy venue without > written rules or warning) is nothing more than a "GANG" and is > destined to die. > > 1) Please show me the rules under which removal of the HackFests from > the calendar was made? If there was a scheduling issue, why was I not > called or allowed to reschedule? Our security community and active > interns have been historically very changeable and this could be > easily arranged at DeVry University who also provide a rack at OneNeck. > 2) Please show me the rules that state posting a discussion to more > than one mailing list with the same content is disallowed? It is not > on any of the mailing list phxlinux.org pages? > > 3) And while we are talking about it, please show me the rules (in any > PLUG) that state that we can't have TWO PLUG EVENTS on the same day? > Is that because the website php CMS software won't allow it? [/LAUGH] > > I have a HackFest iPhone and Android app ready (which can be released > in the next week) to submit to Google Play and Apple Store. I will > happily leave the phxlinux.org and PLUG name out > of that code. > > Thanks for "allowing me" to continue to announce the HackFests on the > mailing lists. > > Happy ThanksGiving > > On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 1:08 AM, der.hans > wrote: > > Am 29. Nov, 2014 schwätzte Lisa Kachold so: > > moin moin Lisa, > > I was curious as to why you have removed the Hackfests (2nd > Saturday of > every month) afrom the PLUG Calendar? > > > You've been acting as a seperate group for years. You have your > own web > site and mailing list for your group. > > > > You may continue announcing your events on the list, but please stop > cross-posting to multiple lists. > > ciao, > > der.hans > > > Hackfests have been going strong since 2008 and have students > from ITT and > strong support from DeVry where instructors provide extra > credit to their > security students for attendance. > > DeVry University provides a rack for PLUG use (providing it is > actually > used in context with student related open source activities) > at OneNeck > which is populated with a VMWare ESXi 5.5 server, OpenVPN > server, Security > Onion, Metasploitable and other images for demonstration > purposes, all of > which has been built entirely with community contributed > assets and intern > effort. We contribute Kali CD's for lab demonstration use, > promotional tee > shirts and shared DefCon videos each year. > > We have a large following of local security professionals, > with visits from > University of Phoenix, Palo Verde Nuclear, Department of the > Army and > GoDaddy staff. > > I have received no notice related to any new requirements or > change? > > I have posted monthly announcements to the PLUG Announce list > since 2008 > and have never been notified of any other PLUG requirements? > > Please add this great linux security lab venue back to the > PLUG Schedule. > > 2nd Saturday of every month 11:00 - 2:00 PM. > DeVry University > > Thanks > > > -- > # http://www.LuftHans.com/ http://www.PhxLinux.org/ > # A Polish friend of mine got an offer for a free account from > AOL. The > # login ID was "HELLO" and the passwd "CYMBAL". She says "cymbal" > is like > # a Polish word for "sucker". 'Hello sucker', a greeting from > AOHell :). > > > > > --------------------------------------------------- > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: > http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss