thanks, Jon. I think I'll take it in. I get the fan warning and the internet switch still will not turn on when I'm running it off of the battery. :-)~MIKE~(-: On Fri, Sep 19, 2014 at 5:12 AM, Jon Kettenhofen wrote: > Sure, a bad power supply will not only affect the fans but it can affect > everything in the computer! > > What do you think? The power supply failed because it got too hot because > the cooling fan did not do it's job? Maybe. But you won't be able to > diagnose the fan or other failures until you determine the status of the > power supply. Considering that you have seen multiple symptoms, it could > point to either the power supply or the motherboard. The easiest way I can > think of to diagnose the power supply is to trade power supplies with a > duplicate quad system quad and see if the symptoms move to the duplicate > quad system. If not, then the motherboard becomes suspect. > > I'm saying duplicate quad because quads draw the most power and the > failure should be obvious on the duplicate. Otherwise if the symptoms did > not show up on either system, then the diagnosis would be in doubt because > it could be a power supply cable or connector and the exchange fixed the > problem, possibly only temporarily (time will tell). > > On the other hand, if you just buy a duplicate (make sure it's for a quad) > power supply and exchange the supplies, you won't be sure that the old > power supply was bad or that you just fixed a cable problem - assuming you > haven't ruled out the cable/connector at fault. > > I've seen power supplies on ebay for about $100 in the past but make sure > the dealer is reputable whatever you pay - if you go that way. > > There's a fellow in Florida who repairs motherboards for PC's for $169 but > I don't know if he does Mac motherboards and you have to pay postage to > ship the board to him. (Pack it well and insure it!) > > If you replace the power supply and still have the symptoms, then can you > return the extra power supply? > > Anyway, if you can boot and run, try the Apple hardware diagnostics if you > have the DVD. Or if you have a copy of Tech Tool (Pro) try to boot that. > It takes a while to boot because it does so with it's own system without > violating Apple's copyrights, etc. I know Tech Tool Pro is stand alone and > tests all the hardware because I use it. Since my Mac G5 is down, I don't > know if it tests the power supply, but it should. > > Jon > > > > > On 09/18/2014 09:35 PM, Michael Havens wrote: > >> so the power supply will affect the cooling fan? If so this might be an >> easy fix. What about the internet switch? That was the first thing that >> failed. >> >> :-)~MIKE~(-: >> >> On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 5:24 PM, Jon Kettenhofen > > wrote: >> >> Michael, >> BTW, Apple publishes a hardware diagnostic CD or DVD, in fact it may >> be on the original install DVDs that came with the machine. If you >> can boot the machine, see if you can run the diagnostics. >> Jon >> >> On 09/18/2014 02:08 PM, Michael Havens wrote: >> >> Thefirst thing I di was to stick the live cd in. That didn't fix >> a thing >> plus that doesn't take care of the cooling fan issue..... did I >> tell you >> I get that notice right before bios takes over? >> >> :-)~MIKE~(-: >> >> On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 9:24 AM, Stephen Partington >> >> >> >> wrote: >> >> Have you tried a live CD of any flavor to see if it persists? >> >> On Sep 18, 2014 8:35 AM, "Michael Havens" > >> >> wrote: >> >> when the keybosrd problem stsrted about 6 months ago >> getting >> another keyboard was the first thing I did and there was >> no >> problem with it when I attached an external keyboard. You >> mentioned smoking being a problem? I've never done >> that. You >> wondered about the distro? I run Linux Mint. >> >> :-)~MIKE~(-: >> >> On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 6:08 AM, Lisa Kachold >> >> >> >> wrote: >> >> Hi Mike, >> >> In order to work with the technician effectively, >> you are >> going to want to be closely involved with the work >> process. >> In this respect, you will ask him what he thinks >> the problem >> is, or what his first actions are, for instance if he >> recommends a full diagnostic. >> >> But first, I would do some diagnostics myself >> before taking >> your equipment to the technician. >> >> IT IS A GOOD POSSIBILITY THAT THIS IS DUE TO MORE >> THAN ONE >> CAUSE (but all related to your distro or drivers)! >> >> If you are SMOKING or exposing the laptop to soot >> of any >> kind, you will want to clean the laptop completely >> FIRST. >> >> Everyone has issues with the WIRELESS switch on older >> equipment, just futz with it, as I have never seen >> anyone >> have it STAY BROKEN? But this clearly would be the >> technician stage.... >> >> Various diagnostic programs exist for linux, which >> you might >> consider before spending money on the technician, >> to verify >> power supply, bus, and CPU. >> >> Intel Proc Diagnostic for Linux: >> https://downloadcenter.intel.__com/Detail_Desc.aspx?DwnldID= >> __19792 >> >> PowerTop: >> http://xmodulo.com/2013/06/__how-to-monitor-power-usage-in- >> __linux.html >> > linux.html> >> >> What distro are you running? Known issues with KDE >> and >> Chrome with keyboard I/O are common (which I expect >> is the >> cause of your issues after applying a patch): >> >> http://forums.linuxmint.com/__viewtopic.php?f=18&t=53398&p=_ >> _306336&hilit=keyboard+stops+__working#p306336 >> > 306336&hilit=keyboard+stops+working#p306336> >> >> Spares are your friend, so try an external keyboard >> and see >> if the issue follows that hardware (kernel driver) >> switch, >> then you can be sure that it is application/distro >> based >> rather than hardware based. >> As for fan control, there are various tools and >> again KNOWN >> ISSUES (ArchLinux) with fancontrol under linux: >> http://askubuntu.com/__questions/63588/how-do-i-get-_ >> _fan-control-working >> > fan-control-working> >> Karmic: >> https://bugs.launchpad.net/__ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/__451337 >> >> >> You can use a live distro to rule out your keyboard >> issues - >> divide and conquer. >> >> Using OSI Level debugging, you go to the layer >> where the >> issue exists and traverse up and down to adjacent >> layers, so >> clearly there is only the human level on the other >> side of >> the Physical Layer 1, which is where the problems >> present >> themselves, so the other direction would be the >> drivers in >> linux. >> >> You would rule out issues here with a systematic >> diagnostic, >> use of spares and intelligent research. >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 8:54 PM, Michael Havens >> >> >> wrote: >> >> What can I tell the service tech so I don't >> sound too >> stupid? >> >> :-)~MIKE~(-: >> >> On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 8:03 PM, Michael Havens >> >> >> wrote: >> >> oh.... I forgot to say that none of the other >> computers in my house seem to have been >> affected >> though it may be that it needs to be >> power-cycled >> and/or it may be something that only affects >> wireless and something got on the phone >> lines (my >> home is on DSL). >> >> :-)~MIKE~(-: >> >> On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 7:50 PM, Michael >> Havens >> >> >> wrote: >> >> >> Thank you so much for the detailed >> explanation, >> Jon. You know.... I have a laptop and I >> don't >> have a MAC but I read your >> troubleshooting >> non-the-less. I got to the last >> paragraph and >> realized something that I was told >> happened a >> couple of days ago that might be >> relevant. My >> room mate was home when this happened >> so this is >> second-hand knowledge. She was watching >> tv when >> the power went out then, a second >> later, there >> was a big POP down the street (a >> transformer >> maybe?). Everything still worked with the >> computer though; however, maybe it just >> needed >> to be power-cycled. >> >> Any other comments will be greatly >> appreciated! >> >> :-)~MIKE~(-: >> >> On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 6:56 PM, Jon >> Kettenhofen >> > > >> >> wrote: >> >> Hello Michael, >> >> I'm curious, did you buy this quad >> new or >> did you buy it used or is it a work >> computer >> owned by a company? I get the >> feeling that >> you bought it used. >> >> There's almost always a reason for >> failures >> and it's usually a problem that can >> be >> isolated. If it's a part, it can be >> replaced. If it's something else, >> it can be >> fixed. >> >> When stuff like this starts to >> happen, it >> may be one of three things: a loose >> connection or a bad motherboard or >> a power >> supply. Apple builds solid >> hardware but >> sometimes it gets abuse or just >> used in a >> poor environment with too much heat >> and/or >> moisture or just takes a physical >> beating - >> they are rather heavy. Also quads, I >> believe, have water cooling. I >> have seen at >> least one report of leaks. That's >> usually >> easy to rule out if there's no leaks. >> >> So where to begin? Well, the >> pedant is back! >> >> You may want to take some anti-static >> electricity precautions. First, >> disconnect >> the Mac completely from all >> exterior cords, >> wires, etc. Lay it on its side >> where there >> is plenty of light, a clean worktop >> area and >> a Phillips screwdriver. As you >> have seen, >> it's easily taken apart, at least >> the easy >> pieces need only your hands. Pull >> the fans >> out, take the video and other cards >> out, >> unhinge and pull the memory sticks >> out and >> so on until you are puzzled how to >> get the >> cooling shrouds out. (Don't do that.) >> Inspect everything. Look for any >> corrosion. Remove as much dirt and >> dust as >> you can with an air duster can >> (take care >> here, the these cans may contain >> hydrocarbons that are flammable and >> they >> should not be inhaled!). If you >> use an air >> compressor, be gentle and use lower >> pressure >> less than 40psi. What you can't >> get out >> with air, start with a clean >> microfiber >> cloth and wipe without generating >> static >> (i.e. don't rub hard). Make sure >> all the >> connectors are clean and shiny before >> reassembling. >> >> We call this clean and re-seat the >> boards. >> >> Make sure you put the same memory >> sticks >> back into the same slots - it usually >> matters or makes a difference. If >> you don't >> remember, read up on it from a >> manual, >> usually online at Apple.com. >> >> Memory sticks are tricky because >> they often >> won't reseat properly without strong >> pressure. First, make sure the >> middle slot >> on the memory stick is lined up >> with the >> ridge in the bottom of the >> connector. The >> slots are offset from the middle on >> purpose, >> they are only supposed to go in one >> way. >> (Having burned out a memory stick >> by forcing >> it in backwards, I can speak from >> experience! Won't do that again!) >> The way to >> handle this is to use two hands, >> with thumbs >> or your choice of fingers at each >> end of the >> board. Making sure the stick is >> aligned >> correctly in the connector; push >> FIRMLY down >> until both ends of the connector >> snap into >> the stick. Main logic boards are >> epoxy and >> embedded fiber, are very strong and >> can take >> a little flexing without >> hurting them. Same with memory >> sticks. >> >> Make sure the memory is seated well >> - it may >> take close inspection with a >> flashlight. If >> the sticks are all the same size, >> then no >> stick should be higher than the >> lowest one. >> >> OK, reassemble the computer. >> >> Testing the power supply can be >> difficult. >> It's easier with a common desktop >> PC because >> the power connector is almost >> always on top >> of the board and easily >> accessible. It's >> not enough to test a power supply >> out of the >> computer because it won't be under >> load. >> >> Here's how an expert taught me to >> test the >> power supply on a desktop PC (but >> not a >> Dell!) Take a meter and set it to DC >> volts. There will be a pair of >> test leads >> with pointed ends to poke at things. >> >> You will push the points into the >> connector >> until it connects to the metal of the >> connector sleeve. Connect the >> common lead >> to a black wire's connector. Test >> all the >> colored wires with the positive >> (usually >> red) meter probe. Here are the >> correct >> voltages for a PC: >> >> Yellow +12 Volts >> Red +5 Volts >> Purple +5 Volts >> Orange +3.3Volts >> Green don't test; this >> turns on >> the PC when shorted to black >> White -5 Volts >> Blue -12 Volts >> Gray I think this one is for the >> power-is-on LED >> Brown Not sure about this one >> >> The important thing is that the >> voltages are >> nearly correct when the computer is >> powered >> on because that shows the power >> supply to be >> good when under a load. >> >> One other thing - sometimes a part >> can >> acquire a static charge which won't >> dissipate properly. The only >> remedy for >> this is to wait until it discharges >> (unless >> you are a motherboard repair person). >> >> Things that have hurt my equipment is >> usually near lightning strikes. >> Lost one >> treasured Mac to a lightning strike >> that hit >> the phone lines. Took out phones >> for three >> stories above me. Mac did not fail >> right >> away but eventually lost it (sniff >> :( ). >> Lightning strikes across the >> strike have >> taken out a couple ethernet ports >> over the >> years even though my equipment has >> always >> been on a UPS. Strong strike will >> generate >> an EMP which is sometimes picked up >> by a >> network wire of a resonant length. >> Usually, >> though, it's not serious but if the >> storm is >> bad, we'll turn off the electronics >> until >> it's past. >> >> I apologize for the length of this, >> but you >> get the idea of the lengths I go to >> fix things. >> >> Best of Luck and let me know how it >> turns >> out if you have the time, >> As always, take care. >> Jon >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 09/17/2014 06:27 PM, Michael >> Havens wrote: >> >> first certain keys sometimes >> don't work >> unless I hold the key down and >> then after a time the character >> will >> appear (sometimes multiple >> times). >> So it was recomended I pop the >> keys off >> and clean under them. So I do >> and it doesn't fix the problem. >> No >> problem. I'll stick it under my >> table >> and attach wireless periphiels >> too it. >> Then I need to go visit my kids. >> So I figure I'll suffer with the >> keyboard problem. The day I >> left for >> Miami (at the airport) the >> hardware >> internet switch would not turn >> on. >> Then, after I arrive in Miami, >> I turn on >> the computer and a notice >> appears at boot saying that >> 'the cooling >> fan is not operating properly'. >> What problem do you think is >> causing >> this? I called my dad and he said >> it sounds like the hard disk is >> going >> bad. He also said maybe the >> keyboard controller (because of >> the >> internet switch). >> :-)~MIKE~(-: >> >> >> >> ------------------------------____--------------------- >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - >> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.__ >> __org >> >> > > >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or >> to change >> your mail settings: >> http://lists.phxlinux.org/____mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> ------------------------------____--------------------- >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - >> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.____org >> >> > > >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to >> change your >> mail settings: >> http://lists.phxlinux.org/____mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------__--------------------- >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - >> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.__org >> >> > > >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your >> mail settings: >> http://lists.phxlinux.org/__mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> __--------------------- >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - >> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.__org >> >> > > >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail >> settings: >> http://lists.phxlinux.org/__mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------__--------------------- >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - >> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.__org >> >> > > >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail >> settings: >> http://lists.phxlinux.org/__mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >> >> >> >> ------------------------------__--------------------- >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - >> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.__org >> >> > > >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >> http://lists.phxlinux.org/__mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------__--------------------- >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.__org >> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >> http://lists.phxlinux.org/__mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >> >> >> >> ------------------------------__--------------------- >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.__org >> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >> http://lists.phxlinux.org/__mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >> >> >> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------- >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >> >> > --------------------------------------------------- > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: > http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >