gee, where do I sign up? On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 12:57 PM, Michael Butash wrote: > I just dealt with my dad dying and going through the VA Medical system > as a Veteran - all I can say is atrocious. Myself and family literally > saw them KILL 2 other people around him at the VA accidentally in the > span of 3 weeks there, and being government they have no accountability > for their actions. My father was was misdiagnosed for 2 years having > kidney problems, and ultimately was prostate cancer, but trying to treat > his kidneys managed to kill both of them dead. By the time someone > competent (in ER) found out the real deal, he was already stage > 4/terminal, died less than 2 months later. > > His doctor was his same doctor for the past 30 years, and all he ever > wanted to do was pump pain meds into him, never actually *fixing* > anything. The doctor was simply complacent and overall incompetent, > which is scary because customer advocacy quoted him as "one of their > best doctors". Mostly we saw half-assed doctors that we had to lead > ourselves to certain conclusions, resident medical students that > couldn't tell a catheter from a lollypop, and overall the system > generally required us as family to constantly escalating within > management to do ANYTHING to help him. > > ... and this is what we want to do with health care in general? No > thanks, I'd rather just slit my wrists now. > > -mb > > > On Mon, 2009-08-10 at 12:13 -0700, Taylor, Kaia wrote: > > As an ex-Canadian, I can give you several specific personal examples of > why moving towards the Canadian more socialist health care model is NOT > desirable. (Eg I got tainted blood transfusions at the very same time that 2 > hours drive away in New York state, the blood was being screened!) > > > > As someone who knows a US vet, I can give you a specific example of why > you should NOT TRUST the government to mess any more with your health care. > (eg his foot became infected with a diabetes-related issue, and he had to > fight them to keep them from cutting it off!!!) > > > > > > > > Kaia > > > > > > > > I agree our health care system is not as good as it > > > could be. I worked for an HMO 12 years ago and saw it first hand. > > > > > > > > We need freedom not restriction. We need to be > > > free of the current model of health care. I feel the model is > > > alternative health care backed by a indemnity health insurance plan. > > > A plan that lets you go to the doctor and pay them directly. An > > > insurance plan that makes you responsible for 20% of your charges. > > > > ... > > > > > backs and have government fund health care and let businesses stop > > > paying the obscene amounts for health care. Taking the insurance > > > > Regards, > > Kaia Taylor > > > > DevSA group -- tis-dco-devsa - jumpword devsa > > http://dco-sps.schwab.com/sites/devsa/welcome > > desk 602-977-5157 > > pager 6025785439@messaging.sprintpcs.com or white pages > > All e-mail sent to or from this address will be received by the Charles > Schwab corporate e-mail system and is subject to archival and review by > someone other than the recipient. > > > > --- On Sun, 8/2/09, Craig White wrote: > > > > > From: Craig White > > > Subject: Re: ****Re: Geek/Tech/Entrepreneur Stuff to do in PHX > > > To: "Main PLUG discussion list" > > > > > > Date: Sunday, August 2, 2009, 6:21 PM > > > On Sun, 2009-08-02 at 17:33 -0700, > > > keith smith wrote: > > > > > > > > So pumping trillions of dollars into special interest > > > projects is how we save the economy. > > > > > > > > Saving GM was about the democrat party buying > > > votes. Look who owns GM now. This is I did you a favor now you owe > > > me a favor type of politics. > > > > > > > > Not to mention this is more than likely > > > unconstitutional. Have you read the constitution lately? The federal > > > government is allotted very little especially when you read the 10th > > > Amendment. > > > > > > > > I wonder if I get my credit card out and run it up to > > > the limit if I will end up better off? > > > > > > > > The free market has not failed. The government > > > has failed in trying to manage it and our money supply ECT. > > > > > > > > Lets look at one simple sector of our economy. > > > The housing market. The housing market is where the down turn in our > > > economy started. And it all was mostly in the Phoenix area. > > > > > > > > Did you know the housing market is in a state of > > > recovery in Phoenix. How would I know about this. I am trying to buy > > > a house. While houses are at 30% - 50% lower in price now than 2 > > > years ago, houses are being bid on and competition has returned. The > > > government has had little to do with the recovery in the Phoenix > > > housing market. It has been through private investment. > > > > > > > > One thing that has been neglected is that markets > > > adjust. It is natural. When the government gets involved the > > > problems are exasperated and I believe will ultimately be made worse. > > > > > > > > Hyper inflation is projected to be in our > > > future. > > > > > > > > When I make statements about government needing to be > > > pruned to the tune of 85% all I have to do is look at the Arizona > > > government that has grown 60% in the past 5 years. 60% in 5 years. > > > > > > > > What is our state government doing today that we now > > > know that we were deprived of before 2004 ? > > > > > > > > It has been said that Bush spent more during his > > > tenure than all the presidents before him combined. Obama is going to > > > make what Bush spent look like pocket change. > > > > > > > > This alone is an indicator that government need to be > > > timed back substantially. > > > > > > > > Sales tax in California is now 9.75%. Almost 10% > > > of everything bought in California is tax at one tenth. That is > > > outrageous. And they are still having budget problems. > > > > > > > > Talking about budgets, when we cannot balance our > > > budget government spending is out of control. > > > > > > > > I believe that reducing taxes and the size and scope > > > of government will spur economic growth. > > > > > > > > Let the people vote with their dollars. Let them > > > own and carry guns, as long as they have proven to be responsible, let > > > them eat cheese burgers if the choose, let them chose their doctor and > > > their insurance plan. > > > > > > > > I agree our health care system is not as good as it > > > could be. I worked for an HMO 12 years ago and saw it first hand. > > > > > > > > We need freedom not restriction. We need to be > > > free of the current model of health care. I feel the model is > > > alternative health care backed by a indemnity health insurance plan. > > > A plan that lets you go to the doctor and pay them directly. An > > > insurance plan that makes you responsible for 20% of your charges. > > > > > > > > Lets un-handcuff our medical professionals so they can > > > do what they do best. > > > > > > > > Lets un-handcuff our businesses. You are self > > > employed. How do you feel every quarter when you send in your taxes? > > > I feel cheated. > > > > > > > > I think freedom is the answer. So did our > > > Founding Fathers. > > > ---- > > > you are all over the map. > > > > > > The National Debt went from less than 2 trillion to over 10 trillion > > > under Bush. > > > > > > There's no suitable prediction for what the net effects of Obama's > > > efforts will yield. The destruction of the world economy and a > > > depression perhaps larger than that experienced in the 1930's was > > > probably if the government had not stepped in and propped up some of > > > these companies. If you have an argument to make about that, by all > > > means make one. The fact is we printed money to fight an expensive war > > > in Iraq that we couldn't afford and pumped up the economy on a false > > > housing bubble that burst because there was no oversight over the > > > lenders and the bundling of the loans. I personally lay this at Bush's > > > feet. > > > > > > Chicago is 10% sales tax > > > NY, NY is 9+% sales tax > > > by the time our own state government gets through, we will be above 9% > > > > > > The freedom of which you speak is a platitude. It has no basis to the > > > reality of our current economic conditions, all caused by lack of > > > government oversight into lending and the bundling of the securities > > > bundles created with these terrible lending practices. Free market is > > > the problem not the solution. > > > > > > If you want to spur economic growth, take the monkey off businesses > > > backs and have government fund health care and let businesses stop > > > paying the obscene amounts for health care. Taking the insurance > > > companies out of the equation saves at least $400B annually. Then > > > businesses can compete. Small businesses can no longer afford to > > > purchase health care for their employees. It has become obscenely > > > expensive. > > > > > > Craig > > > > > > > > > -- > > > This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by > > > MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------- > > > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us > > > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail > > > settings: > > > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------- > > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us > > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: > > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss > > --------------------------------------------------- > > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us > > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: > > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss > > > > --------------------------------------------------- > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss > -- Eric Cope http://cope-et-al.com