As someone who joined this list at 15 (I won't be 16 until July), I think
it's appropriate here for me to add my "two cents."

I've seen a few "flames" and a few clashes of opinion on this mailing list
since joining, but for the most part, that's been unintimidating. A mailing
list is an easy forum to walk away from. Flames typically aren't directed at
me, and so as someone watching from the sides, I don't observe anything
other than just people. People don't get along sometimes. That's just the
way it works.

Another aspect of this list, in my opinion, that diminishes the potential
abrasiveness of so-called flames is that this list is so informally
structured. Because it is, there really are no "higher ups." This list
basically consists of either newbies or old-timers, but as far as I can
tell, it doesn't say which is better than other. Respect is earned not
simply through technical knowledge, but through helpfulness and personal
presentation. Because of this, if I'm faced with a personal insult, I can
handle it because it's just some guy; he doesn't mean anything, he doesn't
lead the group, he may not even provide direction for the group. In a
community where there are no formal leaders, there can also be no individual
who is completely reflective of the community.

The other thing, maybe for me, is that before I really started participating
in this list, I attended a meeting and an installfest or two. Attending
those allowed me to meet many individuals who belong to this list, and
seeing them in an environment based around simple helpfulness at
installfests or sharing of knowledge at a meeting reminds you that the
ultimate goals of the members of this list are essentially the same: simple
participation, simple community, and that despite whatever views clash and
however brusque any particular member is, this list consists of people that
have feelings, moral judgements, and a general good will towards each other.

I specifically remember the first meeting I attended, there was supposed to
be a brief presentation on desktop acceleration. I had no history with this
group, I wasn't active on the mailing list. I said I had done a little
playing around with XGL and AIGLX, and thought I might be able to add
something to the presentation, or show a few tricks. The so-called "leaders"
of PLUG just let me (at least try to) do my thing without considering my age
or my lack of history with the group. This group is full of knowledgeable,
helpful, and ultimately (and most importantly) genuinely good people. If you
haven't seen this or noticed this, I encourage you to attend a meeting or an
installfest, and see for yourself.

You may find friendly faces more inviting than dark words on a bright
screen, even if you've already found the list itself to be inviting.

--Patrick C.

On 3/28/07, Nathan Aubrey <nathan@paysonlinux.org> wrote:
>
>
> I don't know how old Michael is, but I just have the assumption he's a
> young
> guy, (sorry if you're older!). If I had been 14 or 15 when I joined this
> list
> I would have quickly lost my interest in Linux because of the negative
> attitudes of many people I've encountered here over the years. I have been
> on
> this list for several years, and I've been using Linux since slackware
> first
> came out. I don't feel the need to impress anyone, or push my seniority
> because I've used Linux longer than most people on this list. Nor do I
> feel
> stupid when I ask an extemely simple questiuon that I should have known
> better. I take part in this list because there is a great wealth of
> knowledge
> amongst the pluggers, and I enjoy learning things that others do.
> I felt bad that someone would jump on Michael for something so innocent,
> and I
> don't mean to get political, but frankly it pisses me off that someone
> would
> do that to someone who is trying to learn and just a little excited.
> How many times have you been there before? I've been there many times.
> Unfortunaley I've stumbled on cool things many times in the past, but
> avoided
> posting them to this list for this exact reason, I knew I would be ignored
> or
> blasted for wasting a few neurons.
>
> Please excuse the rant, but you asked for opinions!
>
> Nathan
>