Honestly i liked vista, i ran the beta and it was weird but there were a number of thigns, the weird started to fade away as MS released backwards compatability patches and software developers wrote their code to be more compatible. Windows 7 is looking to fix a few of my bigger complaints of Vista (running slimmer and without as much overhead). but some of the same weirdness is ricgh back on the block regarding driver and software compatability. I get this, it is a beta, and to stay bleeding edge this is soemthing im more than willing to deal with. I also ran my Desktop that is running windows 7 as a full linux machine for a couple motnhs as a test to see what i cna and cant get away with. in the meantime i really liked it as a desktop environment, learned a great deal about it as a workstation, but also realised i have certain needs in my job that just cannot be circumvented with wine/vm. so back to windows i go. but at home once i get a new video card im all over it. Heck my boss and i talk about the delight of running/administering a 100% opensource network. firewall to desktop. and we do some real studies about how much of your personal needs you can replace with opensource software. and i can get pretty darn close. so can he.. we just have a few apps we are trying to sort out. for me the difficulty comes in i am a gamer... and well most of the gams i play are windows based... so i either need to get really creative with wine or dual boot. I personally would like to see a fork of the wine project that will merge the two.. so your wine install ties into an existing windows install so you can attempt to run applications from a dual booted environment. but i think thats a digression. The big hurt on MS is really that people dont like change, and for a long time MS didnt change much. win 95 -> 98 -> ME and NT 3.x -> NT4 -> Win 2k -> win XP didnt chang emuch.. peopel had more or less the Same UI and admin needs and whatnot available for about13 years now. and MS is telling them sorry to keep things going you have to change to this new UI and backend? sorry peopel stayed with windows over unix/linux not becuase of any great love of MS its their desire to not change and learn something new. thats been the biggest grive about an OS upgrade of anyone i have talked with... its different they have to relearn things. now vista and windows 7 come along... thats why MS is laying ppl off. that and the fact nobody can aford to buy a new OS OEM pricing of windows home basic is about 80 bux not calculating discounts and then vor vista ultimate its about 200. windows 7 will be about the same. --------------------------------------------------- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss