David> By and large, you get much better response David> from a user community (mailing list, irc, David> news) if you come in saying: I've rtfm'd, David> tried X, Y, and Z, and cut twice and it's David> still too short! Very true, but sometimes a person is so in the dark he doesn't even know quite what questions to ask. The very question that started this discussion yesterday came up where I'm working yesterday. The fellow at the next desk, who is a PC guy, but learning Linux, is not coming up in graphical mode to a login screen. He wanted to know why. Offhand I didn't know the answer, because although I'm sure I've seen the answer somewhere in the vast Linux literature, I have no idea when or where. However, I've been a Unix user for over 18 years, so I suggested he look at his inittab and execute runlevel. (It used to be who -r ... whatever happened to that feature of who?) Sure enough he was booting to init 3. So I suggested he change the inittab, and run init 5, which he did, and the problem was solved. I daresay a person could use Linux for a very long time before ever becoming familiar with run levels and the inittab. How is a new guy supposed to even know about the existence of such a concept? Is it somewhere in the installation instructions of each of the various distros? I'd be surprised if it is, and even so, I'm sure it's probably buried somewhere in a sea of over-information. So if people have a legitimate question and are struggling with a problem that they don't know even where to look for the answer, the kind thing to do is to just give them a straight pointer. I've asked thousands of questions in my experience, and have found that a simple sentence pointing me in the right direction can be worth way more than an 800-page dissertation on a subject. -- Lynn David Newton Phoenix, AZ