\_ Ok "Holy War Armor"... Have you ever tried to create a data structure, or \_ class in Basic (not the visual one)? If you can not create nice structures \_ you are left with using globals (yuck). ew...VB...you touched me with VB. Eewwww...make my holy armor all tarnished. I can't say as that I have done more than mock VB as VB. VBScript (a similar, headles beast, with all the gooey ripped out) I have experience with. I alternate between mocking VBscript and wishing it didn't have the dumb requirement of continuing _ programming statements with _ when they wrap lines. \_ In many languages you have to improvise functionality with techniques \_ therefore you are left coding instead of designing. \_ I *hate* working around language limitations. Me too; as mentioned before, I think missing an 'eval' keyword as a language limitiation, suitable for instant shift to a *real* language. :-) David