<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#3333ff">Not sure if you're trying to flame bait me John J. but whatever :) </div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:#3333ff"><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div>-- JD Austin<br>Voice: 480.269.4335 (480 2MY Geek)<br><a href="mailto:jd@twingeckos.com" target="_blank">jd@twingeckos.com</a></div><br></div></div></div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 10:33 AM, John J. Macey <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jjmacey@gmail.com" target="_blank">jjmacey@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<div>Jd, <br>
<br>
I think your thinking is out dated. And, specious. <a href="https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLEFA9F546C9975EDD" target="_blank">From
10+ years ago</a>. <br>
<br>
I find it amazing, that no one here will post their personal Blog
/ Website address.<br>
<br>
I agree with Lisa, all the way.<span class=""><br>
<div><img src="cid:part2.09080906.03040305@jjmacey.net" alt="Image" hspace="6" align="left">
<p style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:10px;line-height:11px;color:#999"><span style="font-weight:bold">John J. Macey </span>
<span>/</span> <span style="color:#999">Wildwood, New Jersey</span><br>
<span style="color:#999"><a href="tel:480-242-1503" value="+14802421503" target="_blank">480-242-1503</a></span><span>/</span> <a href="mailto:jjmacey@jjmacey.net" style="color:#dda200" target="_blank">jjmacey@jjmacey.net</a></p>
<p style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:10px;line-height:11px">
<span style="font-weight:bold;color:#999">Managing Partner - JJMacey & Partners
- Biotech </span>
<span style="color:#999">Office:
</span> <span style="color:#999"><a href="tel:480-242-1503" value="+14802421503" target="_blank">480-242-1503</a> / <a href="tel:623-252-1441" value="+16232521441" target="_blank">623-252-1441</a></span>
<span style="color:#999">/ Fax: </span>
<span style="color:#999"><a href="tel:623-252-1441" value="+16232521441" target="_blank">623-252-1441</a></span>
<span><br>
</span> <span style="color:#999">310 E. Hand Avenue #12 Wildwood, New Jersey
08260</span><br>
<a href="http://jjmacey.net/blog" style="color:#dda200" target="_blank">http://jjmacey.net/blog</a>
</p>
<p><a href="https://www.facebook.com/john.j.macey/about" target="_blank"><img src="cid:part5.02040705.05050202@jjmacey.net" alt="Facebook"></a> <a href="https://twitter.com/JJMacey" target="_blank"><img src="cid:part7.09070103.06070200@jjmacey.net" alt="Twitter"></a> <a href="https://plus.google.com/u/0/+JohnJMacey/posts" target="_blank"><img src="cid:part9.08010900.01030407@jjmacey.net" alt="Google
Plus"></a> <a href="https://www.youtube.com/user/jjmacey" target="_blank"><img src="cid:part11.03090500.07070409@jjmacey.net" alt="Youtube"></a> <a href="http://www.linkedin.com/pub/john-macey/5/151/564" target="_blank"><img src="cid:part13.09000602.04090309@jjmacey.net" alt="Linkedin"></a> <a href="http://www.pinterest.com/jjmacey0951/" target="_blank"><img src="cid:part15.03070502.04060300@jjmacey.net" alt="Pintrest"></a> <a href="https://dribbble.com/Adler" target="_blank"><img src="cid:part17.04050401.02080406@jjmacey.net" alt="Dribbble"></a> <a href="http://John_J_Macey" target="_blank"><img src="cid:part19.04070902.05090109@jjmacey.net" alt="Skype"></a></p>
<p style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;color:#999;font-size:9px;line-height:11px">This e-mail message may contain confidential or
legally privileged information and is intended only for the
use of the intended recipient(s). Any unauthorized disclosure,
dissemination, distribution, copying or the taking of any
action in reliance on the information herein is prohibited.
E-mails are not secure and cannot be guaranteed to be error
free as they can be intercepted, amended, or contain viruses.
Anyone who communicates with me, or my affiliations, by e-mail
is deemed to have accepted these risks. John J. Macey is not
responsible for errors or omissions in this message and denies
any responsibility for any damage arising from the use of
e-mail. Any opinion and other statement contained in this
message and any attachment are solely those of the author and
do not necessarily represent those of the company.</p>
</div></span><div><div class="h5">
On 12/02/2014 12:20 PM, JD Austin wrote:<br>
</div></div></div><div><div class="h5">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(51,51,255)">I'm
a lurker on this list and haven't had time to go to an actual
plug meeting in years so take my input as you may... that said
PLUG should take these issues seriously because these are the
kinds of issues that tear apart organizations. </div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(51,51,255)"> </div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(51,51,255)">When
people take the time to cite specific examples and tell you
that they feel a negative bias towards them the wrong response
is to deny their feelings are valid. A major problem most
clubs/organizations have unless they make a concerted effort
not to be is that overtime they get cliquish and
non-inclusive; unless an effort is made not to do so long time
members start to feel and act as if it is their organization
and can seem like dictators to new people. I haven't been
involved enough in PLUG to know if that is happening here but
the emails flying around right now make it sound like it could
be that way. I've seen these kinds of issues destroy groups
before; I'm sure I'm not the only person that has no desire to
be a group that discriminates against women or any other body
of people. </div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(51,51,255)">Linux
is for everyone and has the most diversity of any operating
system I know. </div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small;color:rgb(51,51,255)"><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>-- JD Austin<br>
Voice: <a href="tel:480.269.4335" value="+14802694335" target="_blank">480.269.4335</a> (480 2MY Geek)<br>
<a href="mailto:jd@twingeckos.com" target="_blank">jd@twingeckos.com</a></div>
<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 9:38 AM, Kaoru
Wilbur <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:m.kaoru.wilbur@gmail.com" target="_blank">m.kaoru.wilbur@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>Definitely! Thanks for that.<br>
<br>
</div>
When asked what I would do with my pi, I
mentioned I was going to do a Tor Relay. One
member looked at me, laughed and said, Good
luck with that.<br>
<br>
</div>
Another time, I was assisting someone with an
install. The idiot next to me was flinching
twitching and making grunting noises. <br>
</div>
Finally, I turned off the machine and said, "And
what would you do?!"<br>
</div>
He made a suggestion which was what I actually had
done already.<br>
The woman who I was assisting even said, "Isn't
that what you were doing"<br>
<br>
</div>
Another incident was when I stated that one member
of the installfests was rude and if Todd didn't take
care of that, I would. I was accused of threatening
this member when I was simply stating in front of a
group of people that Mark was a rude arrogant
problem that needed to be dealt with. <br>
<br>
</div>
Now, maybe, it's just Todd. However, I went to
leadership who did nothing until I started making
noise at a higher level. The noise wasn't even about
the gender bias but the push on Ubuntu and the
treatment of members. <br>
Incidentally, when I went to local leadership, he
acted as if I were lying before any investigation. <br>
<br>
</div>
<div>Women come to your meetings and then leave. Maybe
the general population of the group do not realize why
because so many people come and go from the PLUG.
Maybe people think women cannot handle the content or
that they are leaving because of other reasons. <br>
<br>
</div>
I was all but pushed out of your old boys club. In fact,
Todd stated he didn't want me at the installfests. Was
that because I was insisting on positive change or
because I was female. You tell me? He laughed at me
several times. Of course, he was not that nice to other
members either. I never noticed him condescend to any of
the males though. <br>
<br>
</div>
<div>There is gender bias. Maybe not at your local
meetings because it's just ALL LECTURE.<br>
<br>
</div>
<br>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 8:41
AM, Shawn Badger <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:shawn@badger.pro" target="_blank">shawn@badger.pro</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>I have been in the PLUG for a while now and
have not seen any gender bias.<br>
</div>
Can you point to any examples of how the group
is gender biased so the group can work on those
issues?<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Dec 2, 2014
at 12:33 AM, Kaoru Wilbur <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:m.kaoru.wilbur@gmail.com" target="_blank">m.kaoru.wilbur@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>hans, <br>
<br>
</div>
I am sorry you cannot take a
joke. <br>
</div>
Of course, sexual harassment is no
joking matter. <br>
</div>
Accusations of this are quite
serious. <br>
<br>
</div>
I never witnessed anything or
experienced sexual harassment. <br>
<br>
Gender bias is quite obvious in your
LUG.<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div>
<div>On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 10:44
PM, der.hans <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:PLUGd@lufthans.com" target="_blank">PLUGd@lufthans.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div>Am 01. Dez, 2014 schwätzte
Kaoru Wilbur so:<span><br>
<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Well, this was an
interesting thread.<br>
I would like to chime in
here for a moment.<br>
<br>
While I have not
experienced unwanted
sexually advances by
anyone at PLUG<br>
in recent years, I will
state there is a gender
bias, definitely.<br>
<br>
Some people may not
experience this gender
bias because, well
frankly, we<br>
are unsure of your
gender...<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
</span>
That's uncalled for,
especially right as you're
claiming there is gender bias.<span><br>
<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
All joking aside, as a
community, we really could
be a little more<br>
thoughtful, tactful and
less like assholes.<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
</span>
Most of us do a good job. Over
the years there have only been
problems<br>
with a few people. Most adjust
their behavior when it's
pointed out.<br>
<br>
ciao,<br>
<br>
der.hans<span><br>
-- <br>
# <a href="http://www.LuftHans.com/" target="_blank">http://www.LuftHans.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.PhxLinux.org/" target="_blank">http://www.PhxLinux.org/</a><br>
</span>
# "Every person who has
mastered a profession is a
skeptic concerning<br>
# it." -- George Bernard Shaw<br>
</div>
</div>
<span>---------------------------------------------------<br>
PLUG-discuss mailing list - <a href="mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org" target="_blank">PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org</a><br>
To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to
change your mail settings:<br>
<a href="http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</a><br>
</span></blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
<br>
---------------------------------------------------<br>
PLUG-discuss mailing list - <a href="mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org" target="_blank">PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org</a><br>
To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change
your mail settings:<br>
<a href="http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</a><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
---------------------------------------------------<br>
PLUG-discuss mailing list - <a href="mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org" target="_blank">PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org</a><br>
To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail
settings:<br>
<a href="http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</a><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
---------------------------------------------------<br>
PLUG-discuss mailing list - <a href="mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org" target="_blank">PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org</a><br>
To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:<br>
<a href="http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</a><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset></fieldset>
<br>
<pre>---------------------------------------------------
PLUG-discuss mailing list - <a href="mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org" target="_blank">PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org</a>
To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
<a href="http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</a></pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
</div></div></div>
<br>---------------------------------------------------<br>
PLUG-discuss mailing list - <a href="mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org">PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org</a><br>
To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:<br>
<a href="http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</a><br></blockquote></div><br></div>