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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Oh, yeah. I was going to explain my ‘(*)’ - so here is a short version.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>When you boot a live cd, for things to work well you really want to have it look like you have a writable disk available. The nifty trick that (some?) live CDs use is to use what amounts to a hierarchical file storage system (probably have the wrong name here).<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><br>That is, at the bottom is a compressed filesystem on the CD, which you expand and see somehow.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>When you try to write to that expanded filesystem, the data is copied to what amounts to a ramdisk and the system now sends all requests for that (part of the) file to the ramdisk rather than the original spot. So every block on the disk you write ends up taking 512 bytes (or so) of ram. Sort of ;-) But, if you download 100Meg, then you need to have that much RAM to spare. If you set up swap it might help a little. Or connect an actual disk (via usb or whatever) and do your download and extraction and so forth there as much as possible, then you will avoid most of the ram usage (since you aren’t writing to the boot drive, as it were)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Rusty<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org [mailto:plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Carruth, Rusty<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 24, 2013 9:58 AM<br><b>To:</b> Main PLUG discussion list<br><b>Subject:</b> RE: Upgrade to Debian testing hosed my system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Possible? Maybe. Easy/useful/the_fastest_way_to_get_going? Maybe or maybe not </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:#1F497D'>J</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>If you have enough RAM to hold everything (remember, a live CD uses ram to hold changes ‘written’ to your virtual disk you think you are running on(*)), then you can probably do it.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>However, I’d start with trying other video cards. Do you have any other cards laying around you could try? (If not, I’ve got boatloads (figuratively speaking!) - I could loan you a few - what’s the bus you need? PCI? AGP? Something else?)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I was going to say something else but it has escaped me. Oh well.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Rusty<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> <a href="mailto:plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org">plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org</a> [<a href="mailto:plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org">mailto:plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Mark Phillips<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 24, 2013 9:54 AM<br><b>To:</b> Main PLUG discussion list<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: Upgrade to Debian testing hosed my system<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I tried all sorts of F keys, and no response on the monitor. I am wondering if there is something wrong with the driver. I had this problem on a different machine, and I had to download, compile, and install a new radeon driver. I can take the machine apart and see what the video card is and see if that is a problem. Is there a way to fix a driver problem with a live cd?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Mark<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 8:34 AM, Carruth, Rusty <<a href="mailto:Rusty.Carruth@smartstoragesys.com" target="_blank">Rusty.Carruth@smartstoragesys.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>If you hit control-alt-F1 (or F2 or … all the way to F6) do you see anything?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>What happens on the monitor while you boot?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I’ve seen cases (personally) where an install decides the monitor can do more than it can (and I think I had an upgrade do that once also), leaving you with a dead monitor.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>However, given that you cannot ssh into it I’ll bet that won’t be the case - but hopefully you can see something on the monitor as it boots…</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Rusty</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> <a href="mailto:plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org" target="_blank">plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org" target="_blank">plug-discuss-bounces@lists.phxlinux.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Mark Phillips<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 24, 2013 8:21 AM<br><b>To:</b> Main PLUG discussion list<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: Upgrade to Debian testing hosed my system</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Mike,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Unfortunately, there is still no signal after a hard reboot. If there were, then I would do what you suggest. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Any ideas on how I can determine what is wrong by using something like a knoppix cd?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Mark<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>On Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 6:52 AM, Mike Ballon <<a href="mailto:mike.ballon@gmail.com" target="_blank">mike.ballon@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>If there is no signal to the monitor with the box "up" I would reboot it.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>From there you'll need to figure out if the boot loader is intact or not. If it is you can boot into single user mode and try to figure out what's going on with the box. If you do not get the boot loader now we're talking about a repair to either the loader or the system as a whole using a disc or memory stick.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><a href="http://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/grub-boot-into-single-user-mode/" target="_blank">http://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/grub-boot-into-single-user-mode/</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>On Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 8:28 AM, Mark Phillips <<a href="mailto:mark@phillipsmarketing.biz" target="_blank">mark@phillipsmarketing.biz</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I used aptitude to upgrade a headless server from Debian stable to Debian testing. The upgrade did not generate any error messages, but when I rebooted I could not ssh into the box (connection refused) nor do I get any output on a monitor I attached to the box (no signal). Apache does not appear to be running either on the box (could not connect to the box). I can successfully ping the box.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Any suggestions on how to fix this this server would be greatly appreciated!<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Thanks,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Mark <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>---------------------------------------------------<br>PLUG-discuss mailing list - <a href="mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org" target="_blank">PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org</a><br>To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:<br><a href="http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</a><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br>---------------------------------------------------<br>PLUG-discuss mailing list - <a href="mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org" target="_blank">PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org</a><br>To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:<br><a href="http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><br>---------------------------------------------------<br>PLUG-discuss mailing list - <a href="mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org">PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org</a><br>To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:<br><a href="http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></div></div></body></html>