I read chip maker TSMC is a sweatshop

techlists at phpcoderusa.com techlists at phpcoderusa.com
Mon Jul 17 08:04:06 MST 2023 

About 15 years ago while living in Tucson, I made a posted about H1B and 
Gabrielle Giffords to the Tucson Free Unix list (now shutdown). As I 
recall she wanted to expand the H1B system.

I was met with hostility and one guy went as far as to ask if I were 
afraid of more qualified people.  Yikes!!  Talk about cutting your own 
throat.

These systems only make politicians rich and it is at the expense of all 
of us.

What good does it do to hire offshore for pennies on the dollar?  Some 
or most of that money goes back home and one more American is left under 
employed because they end up doing something like level 1 at GoDaddy.  
AND that American is less likely to afford what that H1B visa company is 
making.  These programs hurt our economy.

I had a guy make a comment on my YouTube channel that he has responded 
to numerous job post and does not even get a response.  I assume most of 
the problem is the slowing economy (also Gov. created).

I lived through super high inflation in the 70's and 80's.  It effected 
me and unbeknown to me it became baggage.

By the way, these types of posts are a product of poor leadership at all 
levels of Government.

I've been on this list since 1999 or so.  Everyone on this list has 
helped me a lot.  I've had tons of questions along the way and have 
received lots of help - thank you all.

I think this list can offer more. As a group we have needed change for 
several decades.

Lots of folk are taking about the pending extreme downturn in the 
economy, supply chain issues, food shortage, etc. Some say we are headed 
for a great depression economy.

While this list started as a technical support group and still is, maybe 
it is time to look at helping people become self trained and help them 
learn how to help themselves.

I'm 67 and have seen a lot.  I spend 4 years in the USMC, 9 years as a 
cop and lost two colleagues in the line of duty, I created myself a job 
by becoming a freelance PHP developer. Maybe that is why I am such a big 
mouth.  Went toe to toe with John McCain and he called me a jerk.  Made 
the news.

I'm at a point where I think I have seen enough to have some idea what 
is going on.

I was hoping by this point in my life I would be watching the grass 
grow, spend some time working on my old RV, and enjoy owning a classic 
muscle car.  In stead I am dealing with double digit inflation for the 
second time in my life.

I want to effect change.  I am increasingly becoming aware that is what 
my YouTube channel is all about.

It breaks my heart to see what is coming to America for you young men 
and women.

Keith



On 2023-07-17 04:21, Samuel Carter via PLUG-discuss wrote:
> I’m with Der.Hans.
> 
> On Sun, Jul 16, 2023 at 11:04 PM George Toft via PLUG-discuss
> <plug-discuss at lists.phxlinux.org> wrote:
> 
>> There was no judgement in my statements - just observations and
>> arithmetic.  Nor am I making any assertion about value - indeed, for
>> my current role, my value is only determined by the lack of Eric
>> Snowden type of security breaches.
>> 
>> If you want to hear judgements, I can digress on how
>> government-backed, guaranteed, student loans inflated the price of
>> education, and how the government should have never gotten involved
>> with it and they shouldn't have nationalized it,  but I won't :)
>> Funny you should mention the competition.  I had a friend from
>> Singapore who had to go to England for her Undergraduate degree and
>> then to the US for her Graduate because she couldn't get into
>> college in Singapore.
>> 
>> I have been a staunch supporter of the college system in this
>> country, but I work with people who have no college, and some of us
>> have Graduate degrees.  For the field I'm in, one could self-learn
>> and avoid college.  And as I retrain for my next career, I have also
>> returned to college and am becoming very disillusioned.  The
>> curriculum is teaching tool sets rather than concepts, and at this
>> point, I can pick up some vendor training and certifications for
>> free and some 4-day industry workshops for the same price as a 3
>> semester hour class.  So why should I go to college?
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> George Toft
>> 
>> On 7/7/2023 2:39 PM, trent shipley via PLUG-discuss wrote:
>> 
>> :So you're saying the Indians and Argientinans obviously deserved
>> the job more than you since they would do the same work for less
>> money?  Also, why would an American be better at the job than
>> someone from anywhere else?  Or are you saying you are better than
>> most of your peers in general, you're part of the 20% of your
>> profession who generate 80% of the value.  I mean the competition to
>> get into a third-world government university is fierce, especially
>> if it's ranked.  The selectivity of admission rates match MIT and
>> Stanford, theoretically Indian and Chinese computer scientists as a
>> population should outperform their European, and even more their
>> American competition.
>> 
>> On Fri, Jul 7, 2023 at 2:29 PM George Toft via PLUG-discuss
>> <plug-discuss at lists.phxlinux.org> wrote:
>> The only shortage that exists is technical people with Bachelors
>> Degrees
>> willing to work for minimum wage.
>> 
>> Case in point.  My employer is required to post HR crap in the
>> public
>> spaces (break rooms).  One of the posts showed Tata Consultancy was
>> providing a DBA for $66K/year.  Tata takes 1/3 (typical), so the
>> resource is getting $44K/year ($22/hr).  My kids make more than that
>> 
>> with a High School education.  This is what the young people are
>> competing against, so why go into this field?
>> 
>> Another case in point.  My job got outsourced to Argentina and the
>> resources were getting $6/hr.  I later heard it got raised to
>> $10/hr.
>> That was still 1/4 of what I was making.  Even if the Argentinians
>> screwed up and had to rework a task, the company still saved 50%
>> over
>> hiring an American on that task, and they are elated at the cost
>> savings.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> George Toft
>> 
>> On 6/7/2023 3:29 PM, Keith Smith via PLUG-discuss wrote:
>>> On 2023-06-07 13:59, James Mcphee via PLUG-discuss wrote:
>>>> Generally, if I hear it from cable news, there's a good chance
>> it's
>>>> just someone drumming up support for something.  In this case,
>> we'll
>>>> probably hear about some kind of H1B system to make sure the new
>> fabs
>>>> get all the people they need, etc.  Same deal as when I was
>> working at
>>>> a company that got bought by Dell, and they failed to retain most
>> of
>>>> the new employees because they didn't have a structure that
>> worked
>>>> with professionals.  Suddenly you saw Michael Dell doing an
>> interview
>>>> on CNBC about the need to extend H1B 'cause they aren't getting
>> enough
>>>> workers.  At the very least, there's plenty of incentive to drive
>> down
>>>> labor costs.  And with the halts for new housing going out, there
>> is a
>>>> LOT of incentive to manipulate the market.
>>>> 
>>>> Am I being paranoid?  I probably need to touch more grass.
>>> 
>>> Are you getting too paranoid?  Maybe not.  I quit following the
>> news
>>> because I think most are fearmongering and not talking and working
>> on
>>> the real problems.
>>> 
>>> I personally do not like the H1B visas because I do not think they
>> are
>>> necessary. If there is really a shortage of tech workers then why
>> is
>>> there not a few major tech universities?  Why does Gates exploit
>> the
>>> H1B and not create a really great tech university? And why do the
>>> politicians allow all of this?
>>> 
>>> We have all we need right here in our 50 states, so why do we not
>> do
>>> things that benefit ourselves and possibly others?
>>> 
>>> These people like Michael Dell, Bill Gates, etc have forgotten
>> where
>>> they came from.
>>> 
>>> QUESTION?
>>> 
>>> I understand TSMC produces the most chips in the world, and is
>> located
>>> in Taiwan .  Where did they get that technology and who paid for
>> that
>>> technology?
> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Wed, Jun 7, 2023 at 1:15 PM Jim via PLUG-discuss
>>>>> <plug-discuss at lists.phxlinux.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Don't believe everything you read on the internet.  I've read
>>> that
>>>>>> Abraham Lincoln blames Donald Trump for giving the gun to John
>>>>>> Wilkes Booth.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 6/6/23 17:45, Keith Smith via PLUG-discuss wrote:
>>>>>>> Chip maker TSMC is moving to chandler and I have read they
>>> are a
>>>>>>> sweatshop....
>>>>>>> 
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>>>>> 
>>>>> --
>>>>> James McPhee
>>>>> jmcphe at gmail.com
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